the difference between good and bad music

W4E

W4E

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Some music posted here is good, but not what you would think of as REAL music, i have the same problem.

Everything i make sounds like a simple assortment of sounds sequenced, NOT a song. There's something missing and it's hard to tell what it is - but most non-proffesional's songs sound like 4 beat/bar electro pop.

eg:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=FMpsnDxNbqQ <--
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhZZEGW7_Xk <--
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaETb4h9zYc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwFQrVz9bTE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrQrxbeAF-A
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_9Tkde4XfQM <--- background music is insaaane & a good remix

Those could easily be made with free sequencing software, but there's something them that makes them songs,
 
There's nothing wrong with a 4/4 beat so long as the track's quality is more than the sum of its parts. But I generally try to stay away from them as much as possible.

I'm confused about the title here. Is this really a discussion of Bad/Good Music or just Professional/Amateur music? The only solid difference is that one gets a paycheck. It's just that a lot of amateur music is usually a steeper learning process. That is not the rule, however. Frankly, there are many amateur musicians with more talent than whatever "DJ Whatshisface" douche bag is topping the dance chart.
 
i'll be pretentious and say the difference between good and bad music is personal taste

Everything i make sounds like a simple assortment of sounds sequenced, NOT a song. There's something missing and it's hard to tell what it is - but most non-proffesional's songs sound like 4 beat/bar electro pop.
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every beginner has that problem.. you just need to make more and more music, find out what works for you. seriously, its a matter of time.. you either follow a genre or find out what you like and make it

also, i love funk house, tech house, like daft punk, i like repetitiveness when it's pulled off in a good way, (i.e that it's actually repeatable) acid music is repetitive as **** but it works

what i think is the most important is for the track to have soul, it's hard to describe it as anything else, you just notice whether the track is serious, or just nice/fun, or whether its a cheap inhonest attempt to profit, like most commercial music.

something is missing because you expect to hear something and don't (either because you listen to alot of particular music, like music without a bassline sounds odd because we're so used to it, music done in microtones/43-note scales, anything other than the western 12 tone system sounds odd)

groove coverage, and the "pump the bass thing", are cheap commercial stupidness. poison is a typical club track though, it works there, when youre pissed. i wouldn't listen to it otherwise

Those could easily be made with free sequencing software, but there's something them that makes them songs,
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basically, catchy hook which is based on knowledge of melody/harmony
production that's based on years of experience and mastering by a professional engineer
marketing the track as a "hit" which instantly turns it into a good track in most people's minds

daft punk use alot of unconventional stuff to make their tracks, cheap compressor units that create their pumping sound, random stuff

groove coverage melody is simple as hell, typical trance stuff, its alot easier to make than you think, you just need to know the aeolian scale and experiment with a bass line interacting with a one note melody

pop music is all about homophony, i.e following a single melody, not several melodies counterpointing, alot of beginners make melodies that interact, too many usually, and it gets muddy easily if they're trying to make a pop track.

try and come up with a good 8 bar melody, make every instrument follow that melody, make a chorus, make the instruments follow that chorus rather than counterpoint it.

post some tracks by the way and let us comment on them!
 
The difference between good and bad music?

COWBELL!!!
 
let me elaborate on abit of my thoughts

the basic idea of homophony is that you want it to be memorable, catchy and dont want to overload the listeners brain, too many notes will sound like "a bunch of sounds sequenced", alot of beginners make their music too complex and full of mud

its better to variate your theme as you progress along the track rather than have lots of variations in one instance of music.

club music is all about buildup. you dont even have to have a typical melody as long as you have drive in the music, lots of buildups with noises, hihats, snares, etc.

Some music posted here is good, but not what you would think of as REAL music
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people are tired of "real" (i.e commercial, i dunno where you got the idea that commercial music is real) music. not everyone has commercial goals with their music. its easy to make commercial music, its hard to make good music
 
By real music i don't mean commercial - there's some music that you know is a good song even if you hate it.

I'm talking about the difference between: http://youtube.com/watch?v=_9Tkde4XfQM
And Sonic the Hedgehog system beep music - which is usually the product of sequencers (particularly FL which i tend to use)

I don't want to use any examples of stuff i've seen posted here because that's evil to the creator, so i'll find some tracks i made on my old HD that sound really lame.

It's really hard to explain the difference but the soul thing like you said is the best way of describing it. Like the songs i make (and other amateures) are 2d, and "real" songs are 3d.

Absinthe:
"I'm confused about the title here. Is this really a discussion of Bad/Good Music or just Professional/Amateur music?"

It's a discussion of the difference between music and organised sound
 
It might be caused by a lack of instruments and sounds in your music. If I've got a drum loop and a synth melody going with no effects it really feels dull. If you stick in a bassline and reverb to fill the sound gaps, and simply add more shit to it, you'll get a more "full" song.

At least that's my theory, and it's probably just only one solution of many.
 
I think that is probably the problem, lack of stuff. I generally keep stuff simple and PLAN to make it more full - but before then i get bored because it sounds like crap so far :[

http://spunge.nationvoice.com/3melod-attempts.mp3

Something i found from a couple months ago, i was basically testing some melodies to see if i could make anything bearable. Normally i would spend longer on something before posting but it does explain my point well.
edit: yeah i just listened to it and the first tune'y part sounds really cheesy
 
Ok I was waiting for a higher pitched synth lead during that grinding chorus of lower synths.

But instead you stopped the basses and THEN proceeded with a too-quiet synth which wouldn't have made a good lead anyway, it needs to be more freeform melodic.

But hell, toss that one in there too. You just gotta try out putting more shit together at once and I bet you'll find it sounding great most of the time.
 
Well as for the organisation of it -> that wasn't the reason i made it, i was basically testing a few things against the same beat as opposed to making a song.

But yeah i'll try what you've said. Thing is though - even the INTRO to some songs (where it is JUST a simple beat) sounds so much more proffesional than anything i make.

eg: http://www.content.loudeye.com/scripts/hurl.exe?clipid=002707401010006900&cid=600111

It's basically a repeated sample and a very simple beat. But it sounds good (even if it's not what you would want to listen to)
 
That's got quite a lot of filters and effects, and the drum beat is very punchy and has attitude.
 
yeah, the drum beat sounds cool = how

If you ignore the vocals it is quite simple yet effective
 
I'm not too sure. Try laying down a beat that you think should be good but sounds flat and then run it through some filters or resample the drums. A short but noticable reverb would help if you want something powerful.
 
Vegeta897 said:
I'm not too sure. Try laying down a beat that you think should be good but sounds flat and then run it through some filters or resample the drums. A short but noticable reverb would help if you want something powerful.
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I think what he's trying to say is, "what makes some melodies/chord progressions sound good, and what makes others sound bad? What is it exactly, about the arrangement of the notes, that makes it sound pleasing or horrendous?"
 
Hmm, I don't think that's what he means. He's talking about how amateur songs feel empty and plain, as opposed to professional music (or "good" music) that feels full, and just really good. Nowhere does he mention melody... I mean we just finished talking about drums.
 
well it's abit of both questions. Sometimes my melodies sound nintendo-istic, and ALWAYS everything sounds plain :[

I'll try what you've said and see what i come out with
 
EQ your shit and compress it, that will make it sound like a "real" song. it will sound like a song even if it sucks.
 
Jesus, everything you post sounds like shit. I assume you're showing us "bad" music, eh?
 
Try syncopating, or changing the note length of (edit: syncopation != changing note length, by the way :P), one of the instruments. Or make more layers - different octaves, different instruments, and so on.

In regards to http://spunge.nationvoice.com/3melod-attempts.mp3 : The drum loop, and the notes, are pretty decent, but you need more layers, or even something to "fill" the sound more. You could try adding a second bass layer in the intro, but you'd need to keep it simple to balance the speed of the main synth - I'm not a trained musician, but I'd do that by filling each of the second bass' bars with the first note of each of the first bass' corresponding bars, and then fuzzing it out a bit and reducing the volume so as to not overwhelm the listener.

Or something, I dunno, even that might muddle the low end too much. Do something with a higher octave, just as long as its volume balances that of the drums and bass synth, and make sure the notes harmonize properly.

For your second song, it sounds like a hip-hop sample mix, as if it's missing something by intention. Again, just layer something in another octave, to fill out the frequencies.
 
i'll take all that into consideration and start making something.

Btw does anyone know of a good site to get samples? (prefably free)
 
thepiratebay.org :E

On a more serious note, you could probably just Google it, I managed to find a couple back when I was fooling around with FruityLoops.
 
i dont use reason :[

i use FL6 and makingwave mostly since i'm bad and other stuff confuses me.
 
with your self image its amazing you make any music at all.. if you dont like your stuff why should anyone else?

i listened to your track. i'm to disregard the horrendous kick drum, it screams preset fruityloops.

the bass at first is too wide in the mix, narrow it down a bit, too much distortion too imho, its takes up too much space. also, observe the song from a wider perspective,what does it consist of? basically 3 different leads at three different times. try and bring sounds together, and give enough space for each sound

make a 4 bar or 8 bar loop and try and combine different sounds, leads and stuff and make it fit together, then extend on that. i think you work too much separately from what youve made and try to come up with new independant stuff as you go along
 
Zephos said:
Oh for the love of christ.
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lol. yeah.




I just read this entire thread and now I realize it is ONE ****ING YEAR OLD and the guy who needed help ISN'T HERE ANYMORE, and the post that brings it back from whence it came HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE THREAD.
 
Oh for ****s sake, I just read this old thread as well.
 
****ing same. I was like, ooh, this is interesting. YOu know why? Because of the avatars. That's why.
 
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