Arm Models

[LikeYouMeanIt]

Does anyone have any clue if valve has plans to add arm models to the vehicles? I'm asking only as its a really obvious ... maybe flaw isn't a good word but I can't think of anything else to substitute it.

The problem with Half life 2 is going to be its perfection. As things get closer to realistic, perfect, natural, the elements and characteristics that go against that grain become more and more obvious. So I guess little things like the vehicles steering wheel turning without anyone manning it kind of take you out of the moment.

This isn't really a gripe. I'm so excited for half life 2 that nothing short of another delay will ruin it for me (unless my computer blows up the day before :E ). Like most everyone else, I'm so excited to see the effort put into this game, the responses valve has had to and from the community, the enormity of this undertaking...

I guess I'll E-mail someone at valve and ask the question myself. I know this is a really stupid newb question thats going to get FLAMED but can I have the E-mail adresses I'd need to direct my question to someone who could give me a solid answer (Gabe or a designer?)

 

[Moejoe]

i don't think they are going to add the first person hands controlling vehicles. They want you to see who gordon is as little as possible. therefore, no hands...

 

[LikeYouMeanIt]

i don't think they are going to add the first person hands controlling vehicles. They want you to see who gordon is as little as possible. therefore, no hands...

Hah. Well I guess Gordan is going to have a new arsenal of floating weapons that are mind controlled and that reload at his whim in Half Life 2. They did say it takes place SOME time ahead of number 1, but I didn't think that much

 

[Apos]

I don't quite understand the question. You mean having modeled hands on the steering wheel?

They have said that they don't really like the way the effect works. It certainly would be possible to add it, but they don't seem to want to. They don't want your hands constantly in the game doing stuff: holding the guns is good enough, anything more would just be intrusive.

If you want, you can always imagine that Gordon drives underhanded.

 

[Moejoe]

Hah. Well I guess Gordan is going to have a new arsenal of floating weapons that are mind controlled and that reload at his whim in Half Life 2. They did say it takes place SOME time ahead of number 1, but I didn't think that much

Oh come on you know what i meant.

Of course you will see his hands holding the guns. I just mean that they will cut back on whatever shows gordon as much as they can. If they can do it with vehicles, then they probably will. Personally i don't mind the handlessness in vehicles. It's been pulled off in plenty of games, i never cared about it...

 

[A True Canadian]

If you were to see Gordon's hands on the steering wheel, then why not when he climbs ladders? Why don't we see him using his fingers to push buttons? Why not have Gordon's hands in the air when he is unarmed so that he can sock a few people?

It's not necessary to have a feature like this. In fact it would probably detract from the gameplay. Anyone remember how silly the chick from Tresspasser looked when her arms were on the screen? It looked completely unnatural and creepy the way they were always rotating and bending in ackward places.

"Less is more"

 

[Farfege]

How old do you guys think Gordon is? Its off-topic but what isn't on these forums anymore...

 

[Apos]

Yeah, but that's WAY off topic.

 

[Citizen 1150421]

well he was 30 something when he was in hl 1 so 10 years later. 40 something.. damn close to retiring.. i guess old dudes as heros are cool.. eg. sam fisher.

 

[LikeYouMeanIt]

Not old enough to drive without hands on the stearing wheel

I really see what you guys are saying. I guess I can see how it would detract from gameplay based on the person you are. Personally I think it would be cool because if vehicles play as large a roll in the game as I think (and hope!) they do, then its basically just like holding another weapon. I think its a bit excessive to say why not on ladders and pushing buttons, but I can kind of see how people think its a bad thing for the game. Personally I'd still like it but I mean if they could make everyone happy with this game, well...maybe they'd earn that 10 on Gamespot

 

[kaf11]

they couldnt put his hands on the vehicles alone. the alternative is putting in the rest of his body (being able to see yourself by looking down), otherwise, seeing hands on the wheel that abruptly end would look bad. i think i remember hearing valve say that they tried having gordon be visible, and it just didnt fit with HL2, and i agree. its ok for other games, but i like how it maintains the entire "you are gordon" feel.

 

[Feath]

well he was 30 something when he was in hl 1 so 10 years later. 40 something.. damn close to retiring.. i guess old dudes as heros are cool.. eg. sam fisher.

He was 27 in Half-Life.

 

[hiln]

Gordon is special. He drives with his knees and climbs latters with his legs only. He's just talented like that.

 

[LikeYouMeanIt]

Gordon is special. He drives with his knees and climbs latters with his legs only. He's just talented like that.

and he kills shit like no one i know

 

[iamaelephant]

This crap about "you cant see his hands because the game has to be 'immersive' (what is that, word of the f*cking year? I'm sick of hearing it)" is plain bullshit. If you can see his hands on the gun, why should they just dissappear when he jumps in a vehicle?

 

[Dark Auro]

He was 27 in Half-Life.

He's also been frozen in time or something in the time period of HL and HL2.

My God you haven't changed one iota! How do you do it?

So he's still 27 when HL2 starts.

 

[Apos]

Because there's no real reason to have to see his hands on the vehicle. The focus is the action, not the hands. Gun models are a necessity, because you have to be able to see what gun you currently have selected so you know what's out there to shoot. And if gun models are necessary, then so are hand models to hold them, because floating looks crazy. But for vehicles, you know what vehicle you are driving. You don't need hand models there to tell you. All you have to think is "hey, I'm driving the vehicle, obviously.

 

[Apos]

Bottom line is: they tried it. They didn't like it. They are the ones who can play the game and have the best idea of what works and what doesn't. So they cut it. Trust them, for once.

 

[LikeYouMeanIt]

Because there's no real reason to have to see his hands on the vehicle. The focus is the action, not the hands. Gun models are a necessity, because you have to be able to see what gun you currently have selected so you know what's out there to shoot. And if gun models are necessary, then so are hand models to hold them, because floating looks crazy. But for vehicles, you know what vehicle you are driving. You don't need hand models there to tell you. All you have to think is "hey, I'm driving the vehicle, obviously.

See I agree with you wholly. Thats why I think that my argument is kind of valid. LIke I said I understand that with the hand models it may become intrusive, but what you said "The focus is the action...". Well, every part that detracts from the realism takes you out of the action. What if in doom 3 they had all the high tech shit, everything cool, but when you walked past mirrors for some dumb reason you couldnt see your own reflection (this was the case in many games, and is still the case in Max Payne 2 with a lower end graphics card). It doesnt do anything to the gameplay, the pace of the game, anything at all. it doesnt slow down the action.

but it throws you off a beat

 

[Apos]

Well, you wont see your reflection in HL2, so GET READY TO BE SHOCKED!

 

[LikeYouMeanIt]

K

Look obviously its a huge conflict of opinion between us and I'm cool wiht that, but arguing it further is just stupidity on my part. You have your beliefs, I have mine, I guess Valve has taken the more practical stance. I think when you said trust valve for once that was a bit presumptuous as I never said I didnt...I just would like to see certain things that probably would detract from the game for the majority but would appeal to people like me.

cool?

 

[Apos]

All I'm really saying is that they tried it, and they decided it didn't fit in with what they wanted. They are the only ones who have actually played the game. We haven't. Maybe they are still wrong, but the fact is, at the moment, we have no way to judge that. They made the choice, and we have to live with it.

 

[disruptioN_]

Yeah I thought that the steering wheel with no hands looked kinda weird, but it's okay, it won't ruin my life or anything...Hopefully.