Combine space assets

[NÜk]

I find it interesting that despite them being a vast interstellar (interdimensional even) civilisation, no mention ever seems to made of the Combine utilising starships or other space elements. Now before people start yelping "Yeah but they have teleportation so they don't need spaceships", let's just think of the advantages of holding a position in orbit over a planet. Constant, real-time topography of the surface, the ability to fire weapons straight down onto enemy positions, the ability to drop troops and air support directly onto those positions, the fact that space elements would be unreachable and untouchable by the resistance, even more so than the Citadels... A simple height advantage would ring true even in futuristic warfare, and would certainly go a ways to explaining the brevity of the 7 Hour War.

One thing which really started me wondering about this is the suppressor on the Overwatch nexus in Follow Freeman. It fires a beam straight up into the sky, with no curving whatsoever evident, and that beam then comes straight down onto the target the same instant. To me, this shows all the characteristics of the beam being deflected back to Earth by some unseen orbital mirror, much like the particle cannon in C&C Generals. So what do you guys think? Would the Combine's space elements be limited to comsats and orbital mirrors for their supressors? Do they not consider Earth important enough to station warships there? Is any light shed on the subject in Raising The Bar (I haven't read it yet)? And if the Combine do have starships, what do you think their main roles and traits would be, and what would they look like?

 

[Edcrab]

Note that the following is pure speculation inspired by my own rabid dredging of the HL2 story, everyone else can feel free to contribute or deride it-

I see Earth as a planet that's not actually close to any other Combine stronghold, just that they've reached it due to the dimensional convergence of Xen and our plane of existence, granting the Combine a convenient route to enter- or, perhaps, merely detect our presence.

I can easily imagine collosal Synth spacecraft floating above hostile worlds and dispensing supercharged death, but I can't see them resorting to such massive technology when we're not a spacefaring species. Although it's quite possible that the suppressor involves some sort of smaller craft high above us, it's also quite likely that it's simply a refracted energy beam or ionised particles dropped from the sky or... something.

So the Union is some sort of intergalactic/interdimensional super empire with near limitless resources, but I reckon they came to Earth merely because the opportunity presented itself- the planet probably doesn't possess above-par resources or tactical positioning, but considering what they'd get just for pacifying a few billion primates with a brief planet-bound war- they must've considered that it was worth it.

 

[Asknoone]

Spaceships: Cliche, common. Would be typical and the half life storyline would be reduced to nill.....

 

[ríomhaire]

i don't think the Combine have any space tech.

 

[Laivasse]

For transportation purposes, the Combine just don't need starships and suchlike if they can teleport. For one thing, they'd have to be able to travel through space at a speed that would make it worthwhile - and what speed would be worthwhile when you have an alternative means of getting there in an instant? Besides it's cheesy. The whole Event Horizon thing of punching holes in universes is cooler.

However, for weapons purposes, the idea of orbital weapon arrays and satellites makes a lot of sense. I wouldn't put it past the Combine to use any means at their disposal to knock 40 shades of green out of a target planet. But one problem, if they were to use anything other than satellites, is; do the Combine have a synth creature that can work in a vacuum? Since it is the synth that makes up practically all of their attack force on a planet, it's a bit weird to think that they would suddenly switch to big spaceships just for the sake of being able to float around in space.

Another is that Raising the Bar seems to give the impression that the Combine actually arrive in the citadels - these get tele'ed in, and then all manner of wackiness comes out. This also makes sense in that the Citadels house their teleport tech - it would seem feasible that all that is possible to the Combine is whole citadel teleportation, or teleportation of forces from within one citadel to another portal or citadel. If the Combine were indeed limited to this, then they'd have to launch all their space gubbins after arriving at a planet - kind of awkward and a bit pointless.

It's pretty much like they're too untouchable to even need space assets. I still work on the assumption that what we see in HL2 is a kind of garrison force. It's obvious on your trip through the citadel that the Combine are just getting fired up - they only even have a fraction of their forces deployed outside. Who knows what they'd be like in full invasion mode.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

To be quite honest, I don't think anyone on Valve has even thought about it.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Laivasse]

To be quite honest, I don't think anyone on Valve has even thought about it.

-Angry Lawyer

killjoy

 

[Edcrab]

I'm still undecided on the concept of Combine technology- for example, are all the black shiny alloys we see in HL2 exclusive to Earth, as they've used what they can find, or are they representative of the actual tech of the Combine itself?

Closest thing to "spaceships" that I can picture are vacuum-dwelling Synth- incapable of proper transit (unless they tack on dropship-esque pods to them) but quite potent bombardment/assault units.

Bluntly, although I reckon Valve might have touched upon space travel, I don't think the Combine have the same need to do it as more classical forces. Perhaps that's why Xen (resorting to the maligned Xen-wasn't-Combine-controlled argument) is important to them- allowing them more efficient teleportation via that dimension.

Imagine how dangerous they'd be to the entire universe if they got their hands on instantaneous transport, like they'd been trying to research at Nova Prospekt and/or the Citadel...

Although that's another thing- does the Union as a whole possess more efficient teleportation, and its just the segment on Earth that lacks it because they're so isolated? It puts me in mind of RTS games and their tech-trees, with colonies and outposts left to their own devices to develop superior (or just alternate) technologies.

 

[Laivasse]

Although that's another thing- does the Union as a whole possess more efficient teleportation, and its just the segment on Earth that lacks it because they're so isolated? It puts me in mind of RTS games and their tech-trees, with colonies and outposts left to their own devices to develop superior (or just alternate) technologies.

Well, my view is that the Combine possess a certain type of teleportation that we don't, and vice versa - simply because neither has encountered the other before. The Combine can use their dark-energy-powered portals to teleport around million-ton lumps of steel full of troops - okay, so they take a while to charge up, but considering what they're capable of doing it's a bit harsh to slag it off.

We as humans are *only* capable of local teleportation due to our contact with Xen - which is supposedly used as some kind of slingshot or whajumacall - and even then we can only fit in a few people at a time, and it's also slow, although in terms of getting people from place to place and not charging up. Maybe physical distance on earth affects this? Eg, Alyx to Black Mesa East was instant; Alyx and Gordon from Nova Prospekt back to C17 took ages, although that might have had something to do with the exploding portal.

I think we can assume that the Combine portals transfer things instantaneously, what with the dropships emerging straight out of the portal at the end. So again, very powerful, very big, good for world to world transportation - the Combine don't usually have to worry about much else after that, I guess, since it probably takes care of itself.

As for my take on the metal - I think they take it with them. In every converted structure on earth, that metal is everywhere in the consoles and fittings, even the simple lamps are made out of it. Why would the Combine go to the trouble of making their own lamps out of weird earth materials, since earth has plenty of its own? Also, if building stuff out of material they find on earth, why would it be the weirdest material they could find that no human had seen before? why not just use bricks? Answer - the Combine possess loads of stuff made out of this strange alloy, whatever it is, and can't help using it in everything they build.

Just thought of one of those conclusive argument type things: The Combine couldn't teleport here in buildings made out of stuff they found when they got here.

 

[NÜk]

i don't think that combine space vessels would be synth, I think that they would use the same kind of construction as citadels and other combine structures, and travel interstellar distances in the same way that citadels are delivered over such distances. They would definately be used as support for ground forces rather than transport (that's what citadels are for), although the ability to deploy small strike forces from orbit would obviously be beneficial.

 

[Edcrab]

Well, that's quite possible, but I still reckon there'll be some spatial Synth doing the rounds, a kind of mixed armada of sorts.

Basically I'm trying to stick up for the primarily-teleporting viewpoint merely because it distinguishes them from the other empires and makes them a believable adversary in my expanded fiction...

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Well, it'd be safe to assume that the probably do have at least some space-based technology, otherwise a space-faring race would hand their asses to them on a plate.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Edcrab]

It's interesting you say that (horribly uncanon commentary incoming): I picture them as quite capable of invading any world they choose, just that- versus the more advanced civillisations- they'd encounter intense difficulties when it comes to maintaining that control.

Just because you can teleport out of nowhere doesn't mean it's practical to do so if some buggers with mile-long orbital cannons blast the hell out of your latest colony... and so thus they probably will have some space-based tech merely to repel that of others.

 

[Marx! II]

But then who's to say they couldn't blast the hell out of said cannon with a two mile long sort? What you can launch into space and fire, you can bulid on the ground and fire quicker.

 

[bvasgm]

Teleportation is faster. Spaceships are slower. That's why they don't use them. [At least as far as we know]

 

[Angry Lawyer]

That's actually a very good point. They'd not likely invest anything much in space travel, simply because flying a capital ship over to someone's world would take years, even if at light-speed. Teleporting ground troops does seem more efficient.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[NÜk]

But then who's to say they couldn't blast the hell out of said cannon with a two mile long sort? What you can launch into space and fire, you can bulid on the ground and fire quicker.

But not as far, because you're at the bottom of a gravity well.

That's actually a very good point. They'd not likely invest anything much in space travel, simply because flying a capital ship over to someone's world would take years, even if at light-speed. Teleporting ground troops does seem more efficient.

-Angry Lawyer

If they can teleport citadels, why not capital ships? I imagine that they'd essentially be citadels in space.

 

[Asknoone]

If they can teleport citadels, why not capital ships? I imagine that they'd essentially be citadels in space.

Because capital ships are cliche, spaceships are cliche. Laidlaw doesn't want spaceships, it focus's on teleportation

I don't think citadels would be in space, either

 

[Marx! II]

But not as far, because you're at the bottom of a gravity well.

That's a good point, but I rather doubt any but the finest of space type fleets could do much damage to Combine anything from up there, again due to the teleportation being a masterful countermeasure to pretty much anything.

 

[Edcrab]

Yeah, I just reckon it'd be a neat twist- despite the strange appearance of their technology they're obviously a very utlilitarian race (just look how basic the pulse rifle looks, what with its bare components but clearly very powerful payload), and thus that might lead someone to believe they're "simple", since they're without grand, extravagant vehicles and battleships.

But suddenly that planet you wanted to bomb has half a million reinforcements appear from out of nowhere; and you're left wondering why you ever thought it would be an easy target...

 

[Jandor]

Maybe they have a Space fleet, but why bring to Earth, I doubt the ISS is a credible threat to Combine supremacy .

 

[NÜk]

since they're without grand, extravagant vehicles and battleships

Well, I'd call the citadel pretty grand and extravagant
Personally I believe that the Combine probably do have strong space elements (Mossman specifies that they can teleport between dimensions, but not within them, so they'd probably need some kind of more conventional interplanetary transportation such as space vessels, now I think about it), and I believe they would have used them as part of the initial strike force in the 7 Hour War. However, they would have no reason to station such powerful weapons around Earth permanently, so they most likely pulled them back to their own dimension shortly afterwards, probably leaving just a basic orbital communication and surveilance network behind.

 

[Marx! II]

Then one wonders why they never seem to bear down on Freeman with any giant force.
Not like the prison rush, I mean giant.

 

[French Ninja]

The Combine do have spaceships.
From the news paper
If you look at one, 2 is hovering away from the smoke. Im guessing this might be a large enough vessel to be classified as a spaceship.
1 can also be a spaceship but it is too close to the United Nations to be sure. :rolling:

So my guess is that once the Combine conquered Earth, they took all their good forces away, leaving the newly established Overwatch in charge.

 

[SirKillalot]

okay...how do you post images...mine never work...

ps: look at the msg i posted..very ineresting find

 

[Asknoone]

The Combine do have spaceships.
From the news paper
If you look at one, 2 is hovering away from the smoke. Im guessing this might be a large enough vessel to be classified as a spaceship.
1 can also be a spaceship but it is too close to the United Nations to be sure. :rolling:

So my guess is that once the Combine conquered Earth, they took all their good forces away, leaving the newly established Overwatch in charge.

No, everything came from the Citadels - Synths and so on. Those arn't spaceships, they could be smog, clouds, flying debris, magic carpets, gunships, helicopters.....ANYTHING. but not spaceships