I have the Powah!!!

[Gray Fox]

From what I've attempted to glean from Kadayi's rants, I think he's expecting the moderators to be like conversational referees, actively encouraging and engendering specific debate and constructive criticism in (all?) threads. I think he's on the wrong forum, personally.

About that, why?

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Because it's not possible? Because we'd need about 300 moderators? Because I'd rather not be so patronising and condescending as to tell several hundred people that I'm going to babysit their conversations to make sure that their opinions are meeting a set of criteria.

 

[Edcrab]

Not to all, but I do believe that as a moderator you hold a certain responsibility to the site when you post that you do so in a positive, constructive fashion. You are the active face of the forum whether you like it or not and how you conduct yourself does reflect upon the site and the communities responses and attitude accordingly. I don't see what's so objectionable about that, it's a positive position to be in.

Neither do I, but I'm still curious how the moderators' conduct has been objectionable?

And be careful not to conflate forum moderation with neutrality. This isn't a political hearing or a court, this is a forum that deals with content like our favoured mass media- moderation here is more about keeping the peace than ensuring that the participants stick to some sort of pre-crafted agenda, especially considering the size of the user base.

Hell, I'd actually respect the team a lot less if they just acted like roaming bots that scanned for cursewords and were otherwise totally bland and opinion-free.


EDIT: Pi did you insert that post or am I just really damn slow? Damn you.

 

[Crispy]

Pi did the right thing in deleting all the posts, case closed.

No.

The best way to handle this would have been to move the existing comments to a new thread away from the news section, give a message indicating this is what has happened, urge the discussion to stay on topic and let anyone who wants to bicker squabble it out there in an area of the site much less frequented than the front page. For anyone following that thread but not posting, the 'moderation' is probably much more embarassing than the views of a few Angry Internet Men.

Deleting posts that don't break any of the sites rules is basically deleting opinions. It should be obvious why that is the wrong move to make. Whether you think a post is relevent or not is irrelevant, you shouldn't delete people's words unless they are offensive or break site rules. None of the posts I saw broke those rules, so deletion is a questionable action to take.

Worse still is that the deletion was made with no notification as to why. It's a lazy and unconsidered effort, and one I would never subject my own forum members to. Only after this action was questioned did Pi give an explanation:

I wasn't trying to make anything "go away", the discussion was horribly derailed and thread was a train wreck. The underlying issues were not being resolved in the slightest, it was just a constant back-and-forth between the same small group of people.
So, as I quite clearly stated in my previous post, I deleted them all to give the thread a fresh start.

This explanation basically states that Pi deleted opinions because they were repetitive and off-topic. But it seems he has not only deleted the repetitions, but the original opinions that were being repeated. The explanation doesn't really hold up.

This leaves me wondering if I should ever bother to post an opinion that coincides with someone else's not-entirely-off-topic comment for fear of it being deemed repetitive. I mean, if you don't know if an opinion you give one day is going to be there the next, what's the point in sharing it in the first place? Pi wanted to give the thread a fresh start, but honestly why would anyone bother posting in there knowing over half the thread has just been summarily deleted under arguably unjustifiable circumstances?

Unless a permanant deletion has been made, there is still time to recover those posts and restore them in a separate thread. But I know how stubborn Pi is so this is unlikely to happen, which is a shame because this debacle does a disservice to what I know of Pi's otherwise esteemed character. I don't think he abused his power, he just misused it on this occasion, but everyone makes mistakes, it's what they do after realisation of this fact that defines their character.

Over to you, Pi.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

In your opinion.

Or, less bluntly:

I've been moderating these forums for years. Believe it or not, I do actually know what I'm doing. There's a very simple maxim that works here - "for every action, there is an equal and opposite complaint"
It didn't matter what I did regarding the BM thread, some person(s) were going to object to it, and then likely tell me the "best" or "right" way of dealing with it. Judging by the relatively few (although vocal) complainers, and the majority of people actually agreeing with my actions, I'm quite happy that I made the right decision.
There wasn't a single course of action that would have made everyone happy, so I used my judgement and experience and made the call that I did.

As for being "stubborn" - I'm not. I just know I'm right

 

[Druckles]

You mean the deleted comments which were basically no different from the ones found here?

 

[Asknoone]

The running of this forum will not change. Not now, not ever. If you do not like it, if you disagree, if you feel your time here has reached its maximum, please - go away. You are not bound to it.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

This explanation basically states that Pi deleted opinions because they were repetitive and off-topic. But it seems he has not only deleted the repetitions, but the original opinions that were being repeated. The explanation doesn't really hold up.

This leaves me wondering if I should ever bother to post an opinion that coincides with someone else's not-entirely-off-topic comment for fear of it being deemed repetitive. I mean, if you don't know if an opinion you give one day is going to be there the next, what's the point in sharing it in the first place? Pi wanted to give the thread a fresh start, but honestly why would anyone bother posting in there knowing over half the thread has just been summarily deleted under arguably unjustifiable circumstances?

Unless a permanant deletion has been made, there is still time to recover those posts and restore them in a separate thread. But I know how stubborn Pi is so this is unlikely to happen, which is a shame because this debacle does a disservice to what I know of Pi's otherwise esteemed character.

Goddamnit, will you stop editing massive diatribes into your pre-existing posts?

And no, you're wrong. I deleted posts. All of them. The ones that started the arguments, and the ones that continued it. I looked back to the first page, saw it all started pretty much straight away and purged the whole lot. As has been done many times before - where were you all those times?
I never said that they were deleted because of repetitive opinions - you just made that up. I deleted them because there was a back and forth argument that was going nowhere. That's not even slightly the same thing.
It's pretty damn obvious when a thread has become a cluster**** like that one was, because there's no discussion of the actual topic going on. If you're planning on your post your on-topic opinion at that time, after seeing the rest of the thread, then you'd be a moron if you were surprised that it gets purged/closed

There may be "time to recover and restore" those posts, but I'm not going to. There's a reason why I deleted them and didn't just close the thread.

 

[Crispy]

Transcript of events:

1) Media about BM:S is posted
2) Several people post their opinions, ranging from excitement to moderate dislike (specifically about bland maps)
3) Several people express their outrage at the nonexistent hatred directed to such an amazing and free mod
4) The moderate dislikers defend their opinion and express their confusion towards their illogical posts
5) This back and forth argument goes on and the fools have more people who have even less idea of what they're talking about join in and obviously don't even read the "hater's" posts
6) Pi deleted every single post so we could actually discuss the news story
7) This thread

Thing is there is no evidence to show if this was precisely the case, because they have been removed from public view. This thread is evidence that seems to contradict your version of events.

 

[Barnz]

Sherlock is on the case.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Oh please, give it up. This is not a court of law. What Sheepo said is exactly correct. I'm not going to restore the posts just to provide a couple of vocal dissenters with evidence of...what?

Really, it's not going to happen.

And in fact, that's it. Discussion ends here. I've already explained what happened, and justified it. If either explanation or justification are insufficient for you, then you're going to have to live with it. Also, I am not going back and forth to see what Crispy may have edited into his posts this time round - something that I suspect he's doing deliberately.


Closed.

 

[Asknoone]

But I know how stubborn Pi is so this is unlikely to happen, which is a shame because this debacle does a disservice to what I know of Pi's otherwise esteemed character. I don't think he abused his power, he just misused it on this occasion, but everyone makes mistakes, it's what they do after realisation of this fact that defines their character.

Over to you, Pi.

Let's leave the condescending, obnoxious patronisation out of this shall we? You are not right Crispy; your opinion is not the basset of all that is morally good in this argument - it is bordering on pure verbal diarrhoea and thank **** this thread has been nailed shut to prevent your mouth from spewing more of it. Alternatively, tie your hands together with barbed wire.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

I should also point out, for completeness that only two people complained about the action I took, out of the 15 to 20 that actually had their posts deleted. Indeed, several of them posted in this thread in support of the action I took.

So, sufficient vindication for me at least. If you disagree, why not make a thread about it? Somewhere else.


http://www.halflife2.net/about/forum-rules/

The owners of Halflife2.net reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason.

 

[Ennui]

PS: Welcome back Edcrab! Good to see you posting around here again

PPS: This thread is ludicrous.