who would win?

[Jintor]

Secondly, it's like saying that an infinite number of chimps can take on Godzilla.

It's true. But it's more like an infinite amount of Tanks can take on Godzilla.

 

[Fadeaway]

It's true. But it's more like an infinite amount of Tanks can take on Godzilla.

The Westernised version or the good old Japanese Godzilla which can breath atomic fire?

The numbers argument is ridiculous and I'm with the using-an-infinite-number-of-chimps-to-take-on-Godzilla argument. Stalingrad during the Second World War proved one thing: manpower means little in the face of superior technology and strength. The Red Army won in the end, but it was a long, bloody battle. The Combine could bring the fight to the Covenant, but only if they wanted a military 'mire.

 

[Jintor]

The Westernised version or the good old Japanese Godzilla which can breath atomic fire?

The numbers argument is ridiculous and I'm with the using-an-infinite-number-of-chimps-to-take-on-Godzilla argument. Stalingrad during the Second World War proved one thing: manpower means little in the face of superior technology and strength. The Red Army won in the end, but it was a long, bloody battle. The Combine could bring the fight to the Covenant, but only if they wanted a military 'mire.

So? Combine don't give two shits about the welfare of their people. Throw 'em into a grinder. And in anycase, isn't it the Combine who have the superior technology and strength?

I guess if they felt like it, the Combine would just drop a billion citadels onto High Charity.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

The Westernised version or the good old Japanese Godzilla which can breath atomic fire?

The numbers argument is ridiculous and I'm with the using-an-infinite-number-of-chimps-to-take-on-Godzilla argument. Stalingrad during the Second World War proved one thing: manpower means little in the face of superior technology and strength. The Red Army won in the end, but it was a long, bloody battle. The Combine could bring the fight to the Covenant, but only if they wanted a military 'mire.

You can't hosestly argue that the Covenant are more advanced than the Combine. The Combine are immortal, they control universes, their leaders have mind powers, they can manipulate dark matter and the very genetics of a species. Plus, the combine have unlimited soldiers that build extremly quickly; all the technology in the world cannot stand up to an army that doesn't run out. Plus, we've only seen about ten of their thousands, maybe millions of super-soldiers.

The covenant aren't immortal, they control a few worthless worlds in a single insignificant galaxy in one of billions (perhaps infinate) universes. They are crazy religous fanatics, no better than al-queda (just on a galactic scale) a limited number of troops, extreme arrogence, and have 8 (possibly 9) species who arne't adapted to combat at all. The Combine army is built for fighting; it exists to fight.

 

[Fadeaway]

Immortal?

Tell that to the Overwatch soldiers we so enjoy massacring in single player.

That said, this thread is pointless: nearly everyone has produced the numbers argument out of sheer, blind devotion to this game.

On a universe to universe basis, I highly doubt that the Combine would win. They're actually not that well made for war because they believe they can wow everyone into submission. Now think: if a genetically enhanced super-soldier with shields can barely take on a squad of seven-foot high aliens who are better than him, what hope does an unshielded super-soldier who can have their arse handed to them any day by a rogue physicist stand?

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

The Westernised version or the good old Japanese Godzilla which can breath atomic fire?

The numbers argument is ridiculous and I'm with the using-an-infinite-number-of-chimps-to-take-on-Godzilla argument. Stalingrad during the Second World War proved one thing: manpower means little in the face of superior technology and strength. The Red Army won in the end, but it was a long, bloody battle. The Combine could bring the fight to the Covenant, but only if they wanted a military 'mire.

Japanese Godzilla. GINO flat out sucked.

 

[Jintor]

Immortal?

Tell that to the Overwatch soldiers we so enjoy massacring in single player.

That said, this thread is pointless: nearly everyone has produced the numbers argument out of sheer, blind devotion to this game.

On a universe to universe basis, I highly doubt that the Combine would win. They're actually not that well made for war because they believe they can wow everyone into submission. Now think: if a genetically enhanced super-soldier with shields can barely take on a squad of seven-foot high aliens who are better than him, what hope does an unshielded super-soldier who can have their arse handed to them any day by a rogue physicist stand?

I can't believe I'm arguing seriously in a Cov. vs. Combine thread.

Let me remind you: which one found and conquered Earth, and which one didn't?

Of course, that's probably not entirely valid; Combine earth didn't have plasma, rayguns, whatnot. So yes, maybe the tiny Combine Outpost on Earth would fall to the Covenant. But that's all it is. It's like saying Iraq could beat America because it could take out a base in the desert.

 

[Fadeaway]

They obviously would conquer Earth: for starters, it was too busy fighting on another front. Now compare that to a high-technology humanity armed to the teeth with an orbital defense network. In short, Halo's Earth was much more well equipped to defend themselves against extra-terrestrial/dimensional forces than it was in the year 2000.

 

[Slug Advisor]

This arquement is pretty ridiculous.
The Combine wouldn't even destroy Covies; they would take 'em alive, strat some hi-tech crap on them, like the Combine usually do, brainwash them and voila! Enhanced Covies fighting for the Combine.

 

[Narvi]

I can't believe I'm arguing seriously in a Cov. vs. Combine thread.

Let me remind you: which one found and conquered Earth, and which one didn't?

Of course, that's probably not entirely valid; Combine earth didn't have plasma, rayguns, whatnot. So yes, maybe the tiny Combine Outpost on Earth would fall to the Covenant. But that's all it is. It's like saying Iraq could beat America because it could take out a base in the desert.

To be fair, only what we have seen of the Combine can't stand against the Covenant. The Combine may be immortal, and have funky dark-energy tech, but what has been revealed to us of their army (which has been generally just anti-infantry) cannot really hold against the Covenant. The covenant army has been very well documented (books, games, etcetera.) They have orbital support, high-altitude fighters, (really lame) artillery, multiple vehicles... no contest, really. We haven't even seen Combine starships, and we've only seen one variety of jet (the Combine pods).

I rather think the Combine could give them a black eye though. The Covenant have terrible ground combat tactics. What's the point of artillery which shoot really slow glowing rounds? The majority of their troops are sucky grunts who lose cohesion very easily. I expect the Combine to do about as well as the UNSC.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

To be fair, only what we have seen of the Combine can't stand against the Covenant. The Combine may be immortal, and have funky dark-energy tech, but what has been revealed to us of their army (which has been generally just anti-infantry) cannot really hold against the Covenant. The covenant army has been very well documented (books, games, etcetera.) They have orbital support, high-altitude fighters, (really lame) artillery, multiple vehicles... no contest, really. We haven't even seen Combine starships, and we've only seen one variety of jet (the Combine pods).

I rather think the Combine could give them a black eye though. The Covenant have terrible ground combat tactics. What's the point of artillery which shoot really slow glowing rounds? The majority of their troops are sucky grunts who lose cohesion very easily. I expect the Combine to do about as well as the UNSC.

But you forget we've seen nothing of the combine armies at all. Just ten troops of their thousands.

And about the immortal thing, A) it means you don't age or catch desieses, and 2) you've killed a combine advisor then?

 

[Rapstah]

*adds to todo mod list*

 

[Fadeaway]

A) it means you don't age or catch desieses, and 2) you've killed a combine advisor then?

A ) Not many people choose to kill their enemy by giving them a cold.

B ) It's a floating slug. All that stands between them and being killed from a single bullet is an army.

Narvi raises a good point: we know next to nothing about the Combine's true scale: all this tip of the iceberg is just that, the tip. We don't even know how big said iceberg is, only assumption. We know enough about the Covenant to know that they beat a highly advanced human race all the way back to Earth and then some.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

B ) It's a floating slug. All that stands between them and being killed from a single bullet is an army.

So you have fought one? please tell me where this happens.

 

[Fadeaway]

So you have fought one? please tell me where this happens.

Read: it's a floating slug. There's a reason something like the advisors don't choose to fight you directly and that's because they don't take too well to being shot.

 

[Jintor]

It might be a mecha-slug. *shrugs*

 

[Que-Ever]

Whoever wins... we lose.

 

[ktimekiller]

Read: it's a floating slug. There's a reason something like the advisors don't choose to fight you directly and that's because they don't take too well to being shot.

nehilist or whatever it was called was JUST A FLOATING BRAIN but did it die from a bullet? nope

Also, who says you cant kill covenant leaders? they are just organisms after all.

 

[_Z_Ryuken]

Whoever wins... we lose.

Who wins, Combine or a company of 20 Gordon Freemans?

 

[Dr. Breen]

Who wins, Combine or a company of 20 Gordon Freemans?

Gordon Freeman #6: "Don't forget to reload, Gordon Freeman #1."

Gordon Freeman #1: "God damnit, you too?"


But seriously, the reason why the Combine soldiers we have seen suck is because if Valve really made them what they can truly be in real life, the game would just be too hard. Valve underpowered them way too much.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Read: it's a floating slug. There's a reason something like the advisors don't choose to fight you directly and that's because they don't take too well to being shot.

Sorry, but unless you've actually fought one, your post means nothing.

 

[kupocake]

It's not just a floating slug, it's a floating slug with Magic Brain Powers. It may be able to stop bullets, or send them flying straight back at you.

 

[Narvi]

But you forget we've seen nothing of the combine armies at all. Just ten troops of their thousands.

That. Was. My. Effing. Point.

And about the immortal thing, A) it means you don't age or catch desieses, and 2) you've killed a combine advisor then?

Ever seen a Combine advisor kill anything? Do their mind powers affect anything besides humans? Maybe Elites are resistant. We can go on about this all day.

 

[99.vikram]

The Combine would crush the covenant for many reasons. :sniper:

1. Yes, numbers. As Laidlaw himself has said once (IIRC), fighting the combine was futile for humans because the Universal Union attacks with a hundred arms simultaeneously. They have such a staggering number and variety of weapons that the Covenant are, well, screwed.

2. Citadels - there are possibly a few dozen on earth. So why not just teleport some into each Covenant controlled planet/starship/halo? After a citadel is set up, a few hundred gunships and striders would vaporise the Covenant armies. Even the Covvies wouldn't glass their own planets.

3. Force fields. There's nothing stopping the Combine from surrounding their battalions with massive impenetrable shields. So long, Covenant.

4. Manhacks, rollermines, etc. Can disable any electrical systems, and can be produced in insane numbers. Ground troops will be ripped to shreds before ever facing the infantry.

5. Fused organic technology. No one can deny that even a CP outclasses a grunt in intelligence and adaptability. The Overwatch elites are even more professional killing machines, with enhanced sight and lightweight body armor fused to their skin.

6. Dark energy. The Covenant need conventional heat to glass a planet's surface. The combine would most likely annihilate a few dozen at a time with dark energy based bombs or guns. It is incredibly efficient in a reactor, and we know that just a tiny loop of it (inside orbs) can vaporise the heaviest grunts. Imagine what a few megatonnes of it could do.

Please note that the Overwatch are not the Combine's primary infantry.

 

[Slug Advisor]

What we've seen is only the Earth Overwatch. The Combine need to have a Overwatch on every planet they concuered (well, the ones with atleast one sentient species). And how much planet do the Combine have? And I don't think they use Overwatches in wars. Thus, they must have another army. And this army was able to defeat all of Earth's military forces in 7 hours.
Plus, what does it take to teleport a Dark Energy Orb in every Covenant ship? Resourses? As if that matters for a intergalactic empite that controls many universes and controls Dark Energy.

 

[Frentzen]

I'd say the combine forces on earth are the cheapest of the empire.
The universal Union must have much more powerful allies and enemies.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

That. Was. My. Effing. Point.



Ever seen a Combine advisor kill anything? Do their mind powers affect anything besides humans? Maybe Elites are resistant. We can go on about this all day.

Yes, but until we actually see one fight, or even better fight one ourselves, we can't judge.

 

[Jintor]

What about Combine vs. Covenant WITH A GRAVITY GUN?

 

[Narvi]

Yes, numbers. As Laidlaw himself has said once (IIRC), fighting the combine was futile for humans because the Universal Union attacks with a hundred arms simultaeneously. They have such a staggering number and variety of weapons that the Covenant are, well, screwed.

The humans were on one world, and didn't have the tech the Covenant have. I can see a Universal Union taking down Earth easily enough with pure numbers. But that's irrelevant. So the Universal Union has many things we haven't seen yet. We don't know what they are. We're going with what we know they have, not what they might have.

2. Citadels - there are possibly a few dozen on earth. So why not just teleport some into each Covenant controlled planet/starship/halo? After a citadel is set up, a few hundred gunships and striders would vaporise the Covenant armies. Even the Covvies wouldn't glass their own planets.

They don't need to glass their own worlds. One Covenant ship per Citadel can destroy any forces that absond from it. I haven't seen any synths which can survive a constant barrage of nuclear fire, even if you assume that a Citadel can.

And teleporting a Citadel into a starship which is smaller than it? What are you smoking? :farmer:

3. Force fields. There's nothing stopping the Combine from surrounding their battalions with massive impenetrable shields. So long, Covenant.

Riiiight. And these shields are magically impenetrable. Despite the fact that we've never seen the Combine use their shields in this fashion, and all the shields we've seen have been fixed emplacements. Can they build the infrastructure required to make bigass shields on Covenant worlds before the Covenant come? I doubt it.

4. Manhacks, rollermines, etc. Can disable any electrical systems, and can be produced in insane numbers. Ground troops will be ripped to shreds before ever facing the infantry.

"Can disable any electrical systems?" Care to explain why the HEV suit doesn't, you know, shut down when a rollermine shocks it? A grenade can take down a rollermine easily enough. Armour-melting plasma rifles should be able to do so as well. And manhacks? A man with a wrench can disable manhacks. They're good against enemies like the rebels, which consist mostly of untrained soldiers and have no heavy armour, but against a trained army with armour support?

5. Fused organic technology. No one can deny that even a CP outclasses a grunt in intelligence and adaptability. The Overwatch elites are even more professional killing machines, with enhanced sight and lightweight body armor fused to their skin.

Right. Cyborg enhancements are useful. Got it. Care to explain why one man whose only advantage over them is effective body armour can take them on?

(Please note that I'm not implying that the Covenant will own the Overwatch. The Covenant have astoundingly bad tactics. This is simply a refutation of cyborg wanking.)

6. Dark energy. The Covenant need conventional heat to glass a planet's surface. The combine would most likely annihilate a few dozen at a time with dark energy based bombs or guns. It is incredibly efficient in a reactor, and we know that just a tiny loop of it (inside orbs) can vaporise the heaviest grunts. Imagine what a few megatonnes of it could do.

Right, the magic technobabble will save everything. We've never seen anything of that scale. The explosion which destroyed the top bit of the citadel didn't make City 17 (or even the bits directly around the citadel) uninhabitable, for instance, so it can't have been that powerful. (Not to say that the eventual explosion didn't destroy City 17.) A Covenant ship, much smaller than the Citadel, managed to destroy a city with just its slipspace wake in Halo 2, remember?

Anyway, even if they could take down grunts with their magic balls, the magic balls are still as slow as hell and can be dodged. And they'll likely bounce off Elites, who have magic technobabble shields as well, and are quite tall and heavy... about as heavy as an HEV suit? Somebody look into the SDK and tell me how much Gordon weighs with suit. It can't be heavier than a seven foot tall alien.

We're going with what we have seen, recall? So don't say the Combine can pull something out of their ass, like OMGWTFPWN supersynths. From what we have seen, the Covenant can take the Combine army (the bits we have seen of it) on. They'll get a bloody nose out of it, but they'll win. They have air and orbital support, people.

Yes, but until we actually see one fight, or even better fight one ourselves, we can't judge.

Neither can we assume they have magical wtfpwn powers. If they did have magical wtfpwn mind powers, they could have disabled the resistance with those magical wtfpwn mind powers. Don't say that they did not want to debase themselves by touching the minds of humans in large scale or whatever. That's just silly. Go with what we know: They can give you a migraine. That's it, really.

What about Combine vs. Covenant WITH A GRAVITY GUN?

OHNO DUDE NOAR WTFHAX.

 

[Jintor]

Ok, but the fact remains that the Covenant is still obliterating the tiny Combine Outpost on Earth.

Then papa Combine Empire opened one massive, multi-universal eye and saw what was slaughtering the kiddies...

 

[99.vikram]

We're going with what we know they have, not what they might have.

If we are going by what they have, the combine will definitely lose. But it has been hinted at again and again and again in HL2 that the Combine have their strongholds in various dimensions, and our dimension appears to be the least important to them.

About the dark energy weapons - I am not assuming anything unrealistic. If humans found an energy source far more efficient than nuclear power, a force which can apparently create a tunneling entanglement field, the first use it would have been put to would be as a bomb. It's what any species would do. And all I said is that a dark energy bomb would outclass a conventional/plasma based/nuclear weapon of the same size.

PS: I see your and raise you .

 

[Narvi]

If we are going by what they have, the combine will definitely lose. But it has been hinted at again and again and again in HL2 that the Combine have their strongholds in various dimensions, and our dimension appears to be the least important to them.

About the dark energy weapons - I am not assuming anything unrealistic. If humans found an energy source far more efficient than nuclear power, a force which can apparently create a tunneling entanglement field, the first use it would have been put to would be as a bomb. It's what any species would do. And all I said is that a dark energy bomb would outclass a conventional/plasma based/nuclear weapon of the same size.

PS: I see your and raise you .

Why would it be better than the Covenant's plasma weapons?

 

[Rapstah]

The Covenant couldn't kill a Strider. Halo weapons are coded in a different way, not classing them as explosive in the Source engine, meaning they'd all be doing no damage.

 

[Jintor]

Why would it be better than the Covenant's plasma weapons?

Dark. Energy.

Actually, I'm just speculating. I don't know a damn thing about the scientifics of either.

 

[knut]

I'm going to base my answer upon who gave me the biggest challenge in both games.

/chortle

Who am I kidding, the Antlions provided a harder enemy for me in HL2.

 

[i am HOLLYWOOD]

The Covenant couldn't kill a Strider. Halo weapons are coded in a different way, not classing them as explosive in the Source engine, meaning they'd all be doing no damage.

not to be mean but. . .

that's the most retarded reasoning i've seen in this arguement so far. . .

 

[Narvi]

not to be mean but. . .

that's the most retarded reasoning i've seen in this arguement so far. . .

Not to be mean but...

...you have the sense of humour of a Mesopotamian canary.

 

[i am HOLLYWOOD]

i think you spelt mesopetamia wrong. . but then again so did i, so it's all good.

And if he's was trying to be funny i didn't catch. . mainly because it wasn't that funny.

 

[Rapstah]

Oh, shut up. It was a joke. :naughty:

 

[Frentzen]

Could we face it? The Covenant wont defeat the Combine. They are ****tards. No one can. Heck I think Laidlaw said that but with different words.
The Combine is a "Universal Union" and can crush everything they want. Thinking of the Combine as Synths and Overwatch is not very clever, the Overwatch is a weak enemy if you are able to deal with them with enough "order". Same with synths. It took the Combine 7 freakin hours to take Earth. 7. The Covenant are just fanatics and have been barely able to destroy a Human Colony.
Now now "Earth forces werent prepared to face the combine" Rubbish. Sure they came to the citites wiped everyone out... So? They didnt take Earth with an Army of Striders hell no. I think Striders actually are a low rung in the Combine Army, and the Overwatch is as close as you can get to expendable forces. They succeed? Fine. They die? Fine! The Overwatch elite is able to hold control of a couple of rebels in a city and a few other issues, but by no means a full out war. Which is pretty much what happened in the end of HL2. Think of them as the "Police Officer" and even though CP is tasked to this, the Overwatch has the task of guarding the planet. A police force. Striders are nothing more than SWAT tanks then only supposed to shoot streams of water. In a Combine scale at least, that is what a singularity cannon probably means.
Things get awry, send more of em. Thats Episode 2. If that doesnt work you send the army. One capable of dealing with a Full out war. A waek one first. If the opposing force lasts long enough means that they are tough.
You send in the really big forces now, and by that that should mean they wipe out humanity as a whole. Fun. We are fighint our way towards extinction.
Meanwhile the Covenant party at Halo.