about that crowbar, and other things

[Apos]

I just realized that you can watch movies frame by frame in quicktime, so I've been doing some really close examination of the vids. It turns out that, in the tenament action sequence, the boards really are breaking before the crowbar even moves: the frame in which they break shows absolutely no crowbar movement at all.

I can only assume this is simply because valve hasn't fully decided on the crowbar animation yet.

Likewise, you can see that some of the combine soldiers react to things before they happen: in the girder scene, one of the soldiers starts ragdolling and moving before the girder hits him. However, all the other soldiers are moving due to actual collisions, even though they might appear to the naked eye to move before the beam hits them as well (what's happening is the the first soldier is crashing into the second, barrels, etc.)

So that's why things don't look quite right in that scene: they just have collision detection set to act a little too early. A pretty easily corrected problem.

And most other things, however, actually look MORE impressive in slow-mo than they do at normal speed: you can really see how detailed the character animations are.

 

[smear]

I noticed that also, the crowbar animations also look very weak. The destruction of the wood also looks very week, look like it's straight from hl1, when the character goes around breaking off those pieces of wood covering the doorway it does not look right at all, this big piece of wood breaks up into 3 smaller pieces.

 

[Cid]

I don't like how the crow bar still seams like it's held as if it were a candle in one hand. I think it should be held more like an axe, across the chest, with one hand on the bottom and the other near the top. Then when he swings it he lets go with the high hand (you see it come lose at the top but remain attached at the bottom). Anyone know what I'm talking about?

 

[Apos]

I actually think something like the original Hl animation would be fine: it looks more powerful. The real problem is that you want the crowbar to IMPACT the second you hit the fire button, just like a gun fires the second you trigger it. But that's not very realistic: you need time to swing you can't just poke instantly. But that feels wrong to the player: too slow and unweildly. So you need some balance between realism and a fun feel.

I think in this case all they have to do is make sure the damage happens after the animation.

 

[dovoxove]

Originally posted by Apos
I actually think something like the original Hl animation would be fine: it looks more powerful. The real problem is that you want the crowbar to IMPACT the second you hit the fire button, just like a gun fires the second you trigger it. But that's not very realistic: you need time to swing you can't just poke instantly. But that feels wrong to the player: too slow and unweildly. So you need some balance between realism and a fun feel.

I think in this case all they have to do is make sure the damage happens after the animation.

crow bar ownz headcrabs

 

[KiNG]

/me wacks dov over head

0Wns dovs too

and yes we all noticed the crowbar thing(i hope) and we are assuaming that it will change and that many of the things u said will change as well, however it is not always a good i dea to assume

 

[neva]

I really hope Valve will fix this minor problem !! :cheese:

 

[simmo]

if they dont a mod will probbably come alone and do it

 

[h00dlum]

cool

 

[Kovacs]

It should be solved

 

[Majestic XII]

Did you notice that the blod (when they hit someone) are from HL1? Or it looks really like it


And one other thing, the streettrams (can you say so?) in the movie look like those here in Gothenburg!

Pic:

 

[Kovacs]

Yeah I also noticed that thing with the blood. And I think it is strange that the zombies have green blood when they were hit, but have red blood when they were sliced in two..

 

[Dax]

lol..weird

Yes about the blood, it was the first thing I was disappointed with.
Looked too much like the HL1 blood sprite when you smacked someone with the crowbar.

Also, just a minor thing but I noticed the reload animation on an ally in the last video is pretty much the same as in HL1. He just moves his hand over the gun and that's it. Ok fine for me, but I know many games that show 3rd person reload animation where the clip is clearly removed and a new clip is inserted.

e.g. MOH:AA and Raven Shield

 

[RoyalEF]

Kovacs, I would think that a hit to the headcrab of the zombie owuld be green(alien) while a body hit, would still produce red(human) blood. Headcrabs can detach from the host if it dies, so a zombie is two creatures in one.

City 17 was designed from a mix of Northern European cities. I recall a city from the Netherlands, Amsterdam I think. DOn't remember the others. They were all favorites of the authors.

 

[Dax]

Well Gordon did shoot a zombie with the shotgun in the leg and the blood was green.

 

[Kovacs]

Yeah, he did shoot a zombie in the leg and the blood was green. Otherwise it would make sense..

 

[Majestic XII]

Maybe its only a placeholder...

 

[EVIL]

yeah.. i think its a placeholder.. the game isnt finished, they started working on the content of the game in november last year (when the engine was finished).. and BTW.. they have like 4 months to finish it off.. so i have faith that all "minor stuff" will be fixed by then

 

[ub3rbr0k3]

About that crowbar... Disappointingly enough, I think it's the final version. Sure, the animation is a little lame. But then again, you can really see the completeness of it too.

The crowbar's texture look very realistic and complete to me, with its shiny part reflecting (or looks like it reflects) the surrounding view. Also, if you have the video with the Hydra, I suggest you look at it again. In the first part with the flying razor things, when Gordon smaks the fist one, the animation made it so the crowbar accurately hit where the flying creature would collide with the view. (which was a tad bit to the left) And when the creature comes in again, you see a different animation of the crowbar, swinging more to the right than the previous.

Things still can change though... There's still 132 days left until the release.

 

[Idolon]

November last year?
But I thought that the build used in the movies were like 8 months old or something...
Or am I misstaken? :\

no wait... it was the build they showed to reporters before e3 that was that old...

 

[xXSMGXx]

WHy are you judjing poor Pre Alpha crowbar ? I mean its obvious Valve didnt have enough time to finish the code before E3 :flame:

 

[Majestic XII]

Originally posted by xXSMGXx
WHy are you judjing poor Pre Alpha crowbar ? I mean its obvious Valve didnt have enough time to finish the code before E3 :flame:

Its beta...not pre alpha.

 

[dovoxove]

isn't pre-alpha and beta the samething.. i maybe wrong.

about the blood thing for the zombies... hope they fix that.;(

 

[GhostRyder]

#1: If it was beta it would be in peoples hands already

#2: alpha, then beta, then retail

 

[2ltben]

Originally posted by Kovacs
Yeah I also noticed that thing with the blood. And I think it is strange that the zombies have green blood when they were hit, but have red blood when they were sliced in two..

That's actually more realistic than HL1, the body of the zombie is a possessed human, and the headcrab is the parasite.

 

[dovoxove]

Originally posted by GhostRyder
#1: If it was beta it would be in peoples hands already

#2: alpha, then beta, then retail

thx for clearing that out.

 

[xXSMGXx]

mmmm, sweeet beta.. would there be HL2 beta test by the way ?

 

[Noj]

I remember reading that there would not be a HL2 Beta or Demo, but I can't remember where I read it so don't hold me to that.

It would be cool if the crowbar animation changed depending on what you were hitting and how it's placed in relation to you. So if you strike a wall on the angle the crowbar skids across it, maybe throwing off some sparks, etc.
The same animation every swing seems a bit off for any hand held weapon.

 

[Apos]

Half-Life Day One was the only pre-release playable thing for Hal-life. I don't remember whether it came out legally on a CD bundled with graphics cards first, or if the graphics card companies got it for inclusion on a future cd, and THEN it was leaked early.

Even if they didn't plan on it, HL: Day One really drove Valve's inital huge successes, but I don't know if they really need such a thing at this point, already being well known.

In any case, I wouldn't expect to see a demo or a leaked beta unless something goes wrong. It would be really nice, for once, for a game to come out and have it be a new experience for everyone.

 

[_-_-SELAS-_-_]

I agree with the crowbar and the blood looking weird, but have u noticed that when u select the nade he pulls the pin out and just holds it then takes out another weapon, u can especially see this bug in the scene where he makes a big pipe swing killing some soldiers wich still looks damn nice.. like the rest of the game...

Still these bugs are minor and will 4 sure be corrected otherwise Valve will get a beliveability problem... Oh well I will buy it nomatter what, and I dont BUY very many games

I could go on mentioning very many mistakes that I have noticed by my self and by reading other threads, but its not that important to me cuz Ive gotten used to them in EVERY other game. Reason being: It would take, what, 20 years before HL2 would come out if it had to be flawless, fun, beautiful and PERFECT in every aspect of realism and then ill just settle for the fun part (knowing HL" will still be alot more realistic than any other games to this date and probably years ahead)) and then gettting many more games that way (and cheaper I suppose)

/me Is also playing HL again for the third time :sniper:

 

[dovoxove]

don't you think we are being too picky? maybe Munro can mail Valve

 

[_-_-SELAS-_-_]

Yeah, its hard to pick on a game that we havent really seen yet nobody really knows when these movies really where made cause its the same movie they have all been shown at E3 its not a guy playing the game showing the ppl what he can do while he plays, his just talking about premade videoes probably made on a machine at Valve weeks or months before so its hard to judge they probably arent even finished with the game as we write... But hey why am I writing all this I basically have no clue about what Im talking about =D :x

STRRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIDDDDDEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
/me runs around in panic

 

[Furby]

Try not to get yourself too worked up about the issues you may have with the engine. Valve has already publicly stated that it locked down the code last September. Anything you see that needs fixing likely will be fixed but for Half Life 3.

In other words, don't make the same mistake many do by ruining a good game for yourself by over analyzing it too early. I call it "death by hype" and it happened to everyone who wanted Daikatana or MoO 3 among many other titles.

 

[xXSMGXx]

Originally posted by Furby
Try not to get yourself too worked up about the issues you may have with the engine. Valve has already publicly stated that it locked down the code last September. Anything you see that needs fixing likely will be fixed but for Half Life 3.

In other words, don't make the same mistake many do by ruining a good game for yourself by over analyzing it too early. I call it "death by hype" and it happened to everyone who wanted Daikatana or MoO 3 among many other titles.

Ya right, go cry me a river

 

[Furby]

right...:dozey:

 

[Apos]

Daikatana was ruined by the developers, not the hype.

As far as HL2, it seems to be the case with most physics events: the impacts and repercussions happen prior to them physically contacting. This may have something to do with avoiding the case in which objects clip each others: things have to start moving before they actually touch.

 

[Calm_Blue_Ocean]

I think you're quite right there Apos. For instance in many racing games (like Nascar 4) the cars crumple before the collision. These are'bugs' that remain in the finished retail version. Clipping issues are very difficult to overcome and there is always a trade off. I'm hopefully that the timing issues can be fixed in HL2 - for instance blood spatters on the wall before the soldier makes contact with the wall in the 'booby trap' video. However, I'm sure HL2 (like all games) will have some unsolvable clipping problems.

 

[Apos]

As far as the blood, I thought it looked fine: frame by frame his head is at the wall when it goes splat, and you could even argue that it came from the blood traveling out of his head from the girder hit slightly faster than his body (though then we should see some of it in the air). Gosh this is gross....

 

[dovoxove]

Originally posted by Apos
As far as the blood, I thought it looked fine: frame by frame his head is at the wall when it goes splat, and you could even argue that it came from the blood traveling out of his head from the girder hit slightly faster than his body (though then we should see some of it in the air). Gosh this is gross....

thought we were talking about the colour of the blood.

 

[M3mphis]

Furby speaks teh truth. The more you hype a game, the less it will live up to what you expect.