'Michael Moore Hates America' -- reviewed.

[Sprafa]

oh really.. whats his IQ then? he has a 266, really? impressive.

Yeah, pretty much around there

 

[othello]

god this kind of thinking is by far the dumbest kind.

we are not a bunch of idiots that are here to be told what to do by the people who hold public office, the people in office are their to do as we the idiots wish.

i whole-heartedly agree... whats your point? i havent contrasted this opinion, have i?

 

[Sprafa]

In my opinion there was no negotiating with Saddam. He was continually breaking the laws of his restrictions.

He allowed inspections.... :|

 

[othello]

Yeah, pretty much around there

lmao... somehow i doubt it :burp:

 

[Sprafa]

lmao... somehow i doubt it :burp:

So do I :angel:

I have managed to de-rail my first topic!

*crowns self*

 

[Jakeic]

i was trying to point out how a lot of people claim Kerry to be a flip-flopper because he flows with the polls on certain issues are completely blind to how the political process is supposed to work.

of course, you never said he was a flip-flopper.

 

[othello]

like i said, he may of been pressured to do so, but if they were going to fire him, why not do so?

my point is... when it comes to an anti-bush setup, you are quick to believe the bush administration is involved. yet when its something a little less important, you are skeptical. why the double standard? why not be skeptical about the bush administration's involvement in certain situations, all the time? or, to the contrary, live your life in a state of complete anarchists' paranoia. :sniper: lmao

 

[Sprafa]

my point is... when it comes to an anti-bush setup, you are quick to believe the bush administration is involved. yet when its something a little less important, you are skeptical. why the double standard? why not be skeptical about the bush administration's involvement in certain situations, all the time? or, to the contrary, live your life in a state of complete anarchists' paranoia. :sniper: lmao

The Bush Admin. has ****ed us in the ass way too many times for that

 

[othello]

:|

Actually I was thinking diplomacy.

War isn't the only way. That's Kerry's point.

diplomacy? diplomacy was given a 12 year trial period, following the end of the Gulf War. look what it solved... nothing.

 

[othello]

The Bush Admin. has ****ed us in the ass way too many times for that

i cant think of one instance... can you?

 

[Sprafa]

diplomacy? diplomacy was given a 12 year trial period, following the end of the Gulf War. look what it solved... nothing.

Read the thread about what was Saddam thinking. He was very sad because Americans never sat down with him and negotiated. They just bombed him and demanded stuff.

 

[Neutrino]

my point is... when it comes to an anti-bush setup, you are quick to believe the bush administration is involved. yet when its something a little less important, you are skeptical. why the double standard? why not be skeptical about the bush administration's involvement in certain situations, all the time? or, to the contrary, live your life in a state of complete anarchists' paranoia. :sniper: lmao

So are you always perfectly objective in all your views of Bush and Kerry? Or Michael Moore and his opponents for that matter?

 

[Korgoth]

false... moore is bribing people to vote for john kerry,



what scares me is that people, like yourself, ignorantly buy into his proven-to-be bullshit. and continue to support him... yet continue to bash bush, no matter how much evidence vindicated him. so hypocritical...



are they? i didnt realize you had seen the film... although its apparent you havent. this movie hardly spends time personalizing their attacks on moore directly, but more on his methods, his philosophy, and his negative portrayals. really the only thing 'slanderous' about this film is its title... and now getting to the hypocrisy.

you people all tell me to open my mind, 'remove the blinders' whatever... and that im some right-wing nut bushie lover and blah blah blah. yet your reasons for hating bush are quite ill-founded, and in most cases, quite easily debunked. yet when any evidence is offered to the contrary, you simply turn a deaf ear. i would venture that i have done more anti-bush research than the majority of the people that have responded to any of my political posts. and thats sad...

anybody but bush right? lets all chant it together.



ill assume you mean the registered voters who were purged from the registrar in florida? you're gonna have to do much better than that. that wouldve happened no matter who was running for president, as it was a mandate from a state election in 1998 to purge convicted felons from the database, due to voter fraud in said election. its just a statistic that most convicted felons are democrats. but hey.. dont let facts get in the way of your anti-bush sentiments!

You talk about people putting words in your mouth? Ha!
Listen man, I was for kerry way before f/911 came out, i'm still for kerry. I have read and watched many a news program discussing f/911 and how they couldn't find anything wrong factually with the film other than two or three small nit picks. Everything else, the ties to bin laden families, the unocal pipeline its all there, its all public knowledge. Educate yourself.

If you don't believe me, how about FOX?
[url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,122680,00.html

Not so with "F9/11," which instead relies on lots of film footage and actual interviews to make its case against the war in Iraq and tell the story of the intertwining histories of the Bush and bin Laden families.

Try again, maybe you'll get somewhere. But I can assure you, you won't change my mind. I've been a kerry supporter almost since day one.

 

[othello]

He allowed inspections.... :|

he allowed restricted inspections, he wouldnt allow the inspectors into certain buildings and areas. hardly an open invitation. besides, he refused to comply with over 15 UN resolutions over the last 12 years, and he completely disregarded the 6 months bush gave him, as an ultimatum, to comply.

 

[Jakeic]

my point is... when it comes to an anti-bush setup, you are quick to believe the bush administration is involved. yet when its something a little less important, you are skeptical. why the double standard? why not be skeptical about the bush administration's involvement in certain situations, all the time? or, to the contrary, live your life in a state of complete anarchists' paranoia. :sniper: lmao

apparently you have very little in terms of reading comprehension.

 

[othello]

You talk about people putting words in your mouth? Ha!
Listen man, I was for kerry way before f/911 came out, i'm still for kerry. I have read and watched many a news program discussing f/911 and how they couldn't find anything wrong factually with the film other than two or three small nit picks. Everything else, the ties to bin laden families, the unocal pipeline its all there, its all public knowledge. Educate yourself.

If you don't believe me, how about FOX?
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,122680,00.html


Try again, maybe you'll get somewhere. But I can assure you, you won't change my mind. I've been a kerry supporter almost since day one.

lol... i know that. nothing in F9/11 is really new, it is just a very public display of these 'facts'... and a very dishonest and deceptive one. if all the facts were presented objectively, perhaps with comments from the left and the right or something along those lines, i wouldnt really have a problem with it.

moore does use facts, no doubt. but he distorts and manipulates those facts to insinuate something that is complete untrue. and he completely ignores the overwhelming amount of contrasting facts and evidence that further disproves his self-righteous agenda.

 

[Sprafa]

he allowed restricted inspections, he wouldnt allow the inspectors into certain buildings and areas. hardly an open invitation. besides, he refused to comply with over 15 UN resolutions over the last 12 years, and he completely disregarded the 6 months bush gave him, as an ultimatum, to comply.

Read "what was Saddam thinking " damnit.

He wasn't around because he was so scare, he didn't authorize some of it because he was hidden and his inferior officers had to auth some inspections.

Read my above post. America never gave him a chance.

 

[Raziaar]

He allowed inspections.... :|

Dude, he allowed RESTRICTED inspections. He would not let the inspectors do their full jobs whatsoever.

Secondly, how has the bush administration ***** you up the butt? You live in portugal buddy!

 

[Sprafa]

Dude, he allowed RESTRICTED inspections. He would not let the inspectors do their full jobs whatsoever.

Secondly, how has the bush administration ***** you up the butt? You live in portugal buddy!

Operation Mass Appeal. Operation Rockigham.....

The USA Admin. is today the most powerful entity in the world. Do not underestimate them.

 

[othello]

So are you always perfectly objective in all your views of Bush and Kerry? Or Michael Moore and his opponents for that matter?

i try to be... but alas, no one is perfect. not bush, or kerry, or moore... and certainly not me. theres a fine line between having formed a set of beliefs over years of experience and hours and hours of research into all sides of an issue, and still remaining as open-minded as one can be, and having a few ill-contrived and opinions, and refusing to accept anything to the contrary. most of what is said about bush here is easily, easily disproven with some simple research and intellectual reasoning. but most just seems content to hate bush for these delusional reasons. :| its really sad.

 

[Raziaar]

Read "what was Saddam thinking " damnit.

He wasn't around because he was so scare, he didn't authorize some of it because he was hidden and his inferior officers had to auth some inspections.

Read my above post. America never gave him a chance.

Saddam was not 'hidden' since prior to the war. He traversed from safehouse to safehouse to protect himself, but that is not the same as hiding. He did not live in fear. And how can you possibly pity somebody who orders the executions of countless thousands, including things as brutal as having people put in wood chippers? Can you imigine the evil of somebody that enjoys watching others be chopped to real life gibs in a damned wood chipper?

EDIT: You can't even get those kinda graphics with the latest video cards! Ugh!

 

[othello]

apparently you have very little in terms of reading comprehension.

not really, but feel free to show me otherwise in this instance, as it is 4:30am and i am dead tired. :imu:

 

[Raziaar]

Operation Mass Appeal. Operation Rockigham.....

The USA Admin. is today the most powerful entity in the world. Do not underestimate them.

No no no... what did bush do to the portugese?

 

[Raziaar]

Operation Mass Appeal. Operation Rockigham.....

The USA Admin. is today the most powerful entity in the world. Do not underestimate them.

The US Congress is the most powerful entity in the united states, not the bush administration. The presidency is not the supreme power in our country.

EDIT: And Contrary to what you guys might try to claim, the bush administration does not control the Congress. Its loaded with both Conservatives and liberals who are both for and against bush.

 

[Jakeic]

psh, we used to support saddam because of the iranians, them damn iranians...

 

[Jakeic]

Originally Posted by Jakeic
well, you're wrong, he retired in order to spend more time with his family. Atleast that was what was released, whether or not he was pressured to do so i don't know.

Originally Posted by othello
for once, are we assuming that the goverment had nothing to do with a suspicious incident? can we say... double standard?

my post looks fairly openminded to whatever happened to our former head of CIA, where the double standard is, I don't know.

 

[othello]

psh, we used to support saddam because of the iranians, them damn iranians...

absolutely... theres diplomacy in action sprafa! look where it got us! lmao. but allow me to pose a somewhat serious question. i think i posted this in my other thread btw...

the situation in iraq is nothing more than a culmination of bad presidential decisions and policies over the last 25 years. isnt it about time something was done about it? as the liberals incessantly cry, 'we made saddam! we helped him rise to power'. well if thats true, and i believe it is, wouldnt it be our job to fix the situation then? arent you bush haters all for personal accountability? if our nation, over the last 30 years, was an actual person, would you not want him to fix what he, essentially, started? i mean, thats what you're calling for bush to do... to be accountable for his actions... only he's too busy taking care of something that should've been taken care of years before.

 

[othello]

my point is... when it comes to an anti-bush setup, you are quick to believe the bush administration is involved. yet when its something a little less important, you are skeptical. why the double standard? why not be skeptical about the bush administration's involvement in certain situations, all the time? or, to the contrary, live your life in a state of complete anarchists' paranoia. :sniper: lmao

i still say this post is relevant. you are open minded to the possibility that the gov't might NOT be involved here... but when it comes to other situations, its a closed book. bush was involved. no matter that the evidence points to the contrary.

 

[Sprafa]

absolutely... theres diplomacy in action sprafa! look where it got us! lmao. but allow me to pose a somewhat serious question. i think i posted this in my other thread btw...

the situation in iraq is nothing more than a culmination of bad presidential decisions and policies over the last 25 years. isnt it about time something was done about it? as the liberals incessantly cry, 'we made saddam! we helped him rise to power'. well if thats true, and i believe it is, wouldnt it be our job to fix the situation then? arent you bush haters all for personal accountability? if our nation, over the last 30 years, was an actual person, would you not want him to fix what he, essentially, started? i mean, thats what you're calling for bush to do... to be accountable for his actions... only he's too busy taking care of something that should've been taken care of years before.

Actually, that was the most twisted diplomacy I can think of.


My point is that there many tremendously more urgent things than Iraq. Sudan, North Korea, Iran....

 

[Jakeic]

i still say this post is relevant. you are open minded to the possibility that the gov't might NOT be involved here... but when it comes to other situations, its a closed book. bush was involved. no matter that the evidence points to the contrary.

show me that post where i do that.

 

[Neutrino]

absolutely... theres diplomacy in action sprafa! look where it got us! lmao. but allow me to pose a somewhat serious question. i think i posted this in my other thread btw...

the situation in iraq is nothing more than a culmination of bad presidential decisions and policies over the last 25 years. isnt it about time something was done about it? as the liberals incessantly cry, 'we made saddam! we helped him rise to power'. well if thats true, and i believe it is, wouldnt it be our job to fix the situation then? arent you bush haters all for personal accountability? if our nation, over the last 30 years, was an actual person, would you not want him to fix what he, essentially, started? i mean, thats what you're calling for bush to do... to be accountable for his actions... only he's too busy taking care of something that should've been taken care of years before.

Except for the fact that those weren't the reasons we went to war.

Hind sight is a great thing. However, I don't consider trying to use it to come up with justification for a war after the fact to be a laudable thing.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

false... moore is bribing people to vote for john kerry, http://www.michiganlegislature.org/...ect&objName=mcl-168-931which is illegal.[/url

That's an ALLEGATION. Do you know what that means? That means that Moore hasn't been convicted in anything.

Hell, did you even read the link you posted? Look at the title:

State GOP says Michael Moore illegally offered underwear in exchange for voting

See the bold? This was a claim made by the republican party that has not bee proven, yet you accept it as total fact. And still, you whine about "hypocracy" so damn much:

what scares me is that people, like yourself, ignorantly buy into his proven-to-be bullshit. and continue to support him... yet continue to bash bush, no matter how much evidence vindicated him. so hypocritical...

There's hardly any proof that F9/11 is entirely false. There are about three points or so that are blatantly untrue. Everything else is quite arguable either way.

So which is more ignorant: frantically tossing the entire movie on the flames because a few sections are wrong?
Or taking the overly exaggerated points into account when weighing the pluses and minuses of the arguments presented?

I can tell you right now that it's not the latter. The movie has flaws, but they are not irredeemable flaws worth the time and effort you put into mocking anyone who respects the show.

And here's another "hypocracy": You hold Bush to a lower standard than you hold to Moore. If you put this much effort and rage into criticising Bush's Iraq policy, you might actually start agreeing with some of Moore's points. Oh, but then you'd automatically be a frighteningly ignorant hypocrite under your own definition.

Where I come from, keeping an open mind doesn't cause ignorance. It prevents it.

you people all tell me to open my mind, 'remove the blinders' whatever... and that im some right-wing nut bushie lover and blah blah blah. yet your reasons for hating bush are quite ill-founded, and in most cases, quite easily debunked. yet when any evidence is offered to the contrary, you simply turn a deaf ear. i would venture that i have done more anti-bush research than the majority of the people that have responded to any of my political posts. and thats sad...

Are you talking about your "give me ONE good reason" thread? Because you haven't put up any irrefutable evidence of anything in there, even after we gave you at least THREE good reasons that you were physically incapable of refuting.

The arguments are so 'easily debunked' that you consistently fail to debunk them!

I am certain that I understand Iraq more than you. I am certain that I know Constitutional Law better than you do. In fact, I am confident that most every person here does too. You still have yet to convince me or anyone otherwise.

All you do is accuse people of hypocracy and ignorance when you can hardly make a convincing point yourself.

Look at the above quote: the guy holds THE PRESIDENT OF THE USA to a higher standard than he does to a quasi-celebrity fat man with a camera. Sensible point, right? But no, he's a hypocrite to you!

You throw that word out as an insult, yet you obviously hold a very tenuous grasp on what it means.

anybody but bush right? lets all chant it together.

See? this is the type of argument you make. You insultingly accuse all liberals of something, without a single fact! And then you complain that no-one respects your opinion!

Your biggest argument against anti-Bush people is that they don't like Bush. Well, duh!

And we're not just here because we dislike Bush. I, for one, am also here because I seriously dislike you and your cocky attitude.

 

[Jakeic]

i just like "talking politics", which you are never supposed to do. people are stupid, don't like being wrong and get mad, however, these issues are important to just about every single person. It's sad that we shouldn't speak of them.

 

[Dem0nEgg]

Wake Up America!

The thread to the USA's global prestige posed by the BBC-Guardian's axis

This CD contains articles, news releases, and other docs proving the BBC's and The Guardian's anti-Americanism and symbiosis -- and offers the means to expose both organizations

Yes, the BBC is so biased! Americans, close your ears! ONLY LISTEN TO FOX NEWS - this foreign LIBERAL media is misleading you! Only Bill O reilly can save you -
It is all part of a LIBERAL CONSPIRACY to put a lawn gnome in the white house!

Britain HAETS FREEDUMB!!!!!!


*ahem* - I think if you wake up and take off your blinders you would see that the BBC is respected around the WORLD to be a bastion of UNBIASED and HONEST reporting. Do a little research on this one.

 

[Korgoth]

That's an ALLEGATION. Do you know what that means? That means that Moore hasn't been convicted in anything.

Hell, did you even read the link you posted? Look at the title:



See the bold? This was a claim made by the republican party that has not bee proven, yet you accept it as total fact. And still, you whine about "hypocracy" so damn much:



There's hardly any proof that F9/11 is entirely false. There are about three points or so that are blatantly untrue. Everything else is quite arguable either way.

So which is more ignorant: frantically tossing the entire movie on the flames because a few sections are wrong?
Or taking the overly exaggerated points into account when weighing the pluses and minuses of the arguments presented?

I can tell you right now that it's not the latter. The movie has flaws, but they are not irredeemable flaws worth the time and effort you put into mocking anyone who respects the show.

And here's another "hypocracy": You hold Bush to a lower standard than you hold to Moore. If you put this much effort and rage into criticising Bush's Iraq policy, you might actually start agreeing with some of Moore's points. Oh, but then you'd automatically be a frighteningly ignorant hypocrite under your own definition.

Where I come from, keeping an open mind doesn't cause ignorance. It prevents it.



Are you talking about your "give me ONE good reason" thread? Because you haven't put up any irrefutable evidence of anything in there, even after we gave you at least THREE good reasons that you were physically incapable of refuting.

The arguments are so 'easily debunked' that you consistently fail to debunk them!

I am certain that I understand Iraq more than you. I am certain that I know Constitutional Law better than you do. In fact, I am confident that most every person here does too. You still have yet to convince me or anyone otherwise.

All you do is accuse people of hypocracy and ignorance when you can hardly make a convincing point yourself.

Look at the above quote: the guy holds THE PRESIDENT OF THE USA to a higher standard than he does to a quasi-celebrity fat man with a camera. Sensible point, right? But no, he's a hypocrite to you!

You throw that word out as an insult, yet you obviously hold a very tenuous grasp on what it means.


See? this is the type of argument you make. You insultingly accuse all liberals of something, without a single fact! And then you complain that no-one respects your opinion!

Your biggest argument against anti-Bush people is that they don't like Bush. Well, duh!

And we're not just here because we dislike Bush. I, for one, am also here because I seriously dislike you and your cocky attitude.

Well said my friend... Well said.

 

[h00dlum]

Damn you sure tock your time to make that post..

 

[Gunner]

psh, we used to support saddam because of the iranians, them damn iranians...

What do you have against Iranians? :|

 

[rkef]

Damn, I can't keep up with these bicker-festivals.

So I'll just make a snide comment:

where to start, he has made a movie (F9/11) that portrays our nation in a very dismal state

I thought you said the movie was inaccurate ?

 

[She]

If telling facts is hating america...

 

[seinfeldrules]

Ok, the "Michael Moore hates America" argument is getting a bit old to tell the truth.

If it is an argument to be made, why not make it? I doubt you have seen the movie, so why judge its points as you pointed out to me?