Nuclear Dawn Media and Developer Profile

[Sulkdodds]

lol ennui
well if you want a semi-serious response *sighs
Isnt there a conflict of interest there somewhere and doesn't HL2.net have higher standards than most when it comes to news
TBH ennui it doesn't matter what you believe because Nuclear Dawn does not exist and every new faked screenshot just shows how pathetic the whole thing is
john out

I was also going to post this but I didn't because I am A. lazy and B. circumstances. But in a parallel universe I posted this news, and maybe in said parallel universe you are accusing me of being a plant or something...the point is, if you're going to accuse Ennui I'd like you to accuse me as well. It'd be only fair.

I sincerely doubt they're vapourware. Say what you want about their (shocking) conduct and methods, but it really isn't that hard to get models working in game. It isn't impossible to get mods to work. I just can't see them not having done it because I can't see what they stand to gain by making a non-existent mod. They'd hype and hype and hype and hype and if there was nothing there at all, they'd look pretty bloody stupid pretty bloody fast. I think it's far more likely that they have less than they want us to think that they have, or that their mod is severely bugged (but does exist) and they want to cover it up.

But I don't think it's plausible that they have nothing playable, to be honest.

 

[Asknoone]

It's that time again - TRIVIA TIME!


True or false:

Most of their development time is spent in photoshop.

 

[Ennui]

no no NO! I think ti is you woh are confused. Games which DO NOT use proprietory engines essentially ARE mods. In the case of Dark Messiah, Arkane jusr have more talented artists and game designers, along with access to more of the client and engine code (they have the source to...source) and the coding tlaent to make use of it.

The difference between this "game" and a "mod" is that dark messiah is retail. But it is, and especially from an artists point of view, still a mod.

Mod is part a sub catagory of "game" where game is a casual leisure activity involving some sort of conflict and at least one victor.

IN terms of ND..i think it just looks like HL2, i want some bloody gameplay info tho. if its CS in the future ill be pissed off

The main difference between games and mods is that first, games have the Source engine license and increased access to the engine code (since they have the entire source code I believe, though I might be wrong). Second, games are paid, which means they can commit much more time, effort, and resources to making their product.

in a parallel universe I posted this news, and maybe in said parallel universe you are accusing me of being a plant or something...the point is, if you're going to accuse Ennui I'd like you to accuse me as well. It'd be only fair.

I love you Sulkie.

 

[iMMuNiTy]

It's that time again - TRIVIA TIME!


True or false:

Most of their development time is spent in photoshop.

True. But that's what makes their mod's quality top-notch. Let's remember how many reference photos Valve has taken before actually beginning to work on Half-Life 2.

 

[Sulkdodds]

It's that time again - TRIVIA TIME!


True or false:

Most of their development time is spent in photoshop.

Answer: unsubstantiated.

 

[NeoNight]

ND is a conspiracy! they do all this hard work to make us believe its a mod when its not. So that they can get us hyped! Their true aim here is to waste time! for the control of time brings forth the control of the world! :O

 

[Gusdor]

excuse me, buddy, but if you want to call me a random ND plant you better back that shit up right here and now. i may be a moderator on the ND forums, but that newspost is fairly objective, and all i'm doing is fufilling my capacity as a halflife2.net news poster when I post news about it. There is NOTHING in that post that you can logically or rationally question.

Judging the media and mod is your perogative, but I bring you promising-looking news, and if you don't like it, don't read the thread. It's not our responsibility to judge a mod team based on anything other than what they officially release.

My personal opinion does not factor into this at all, and I'd like it if you stopped being an asshat about it.

also Simonomis, lol

sorry for excessive quote but you are quite right. It is popular art made with the source engine. That makes it HL2.net news

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Valve didn't photoshop a HUD onto their reference photos and claim they were exclusive gameplay screenshots.

http://www.halflife2.net/news//1151204219_nd_j2.jpg

That is absolutely posed. Probably with static models again.

Since when, in any muliplayer game ever, have three players stood around a door, absolutely still and in an exactly spaced formation?

There's no HUD on the screenshot, the POV is above all the characters, and the camera is tilted to the side.
It's not a "head movement" feature because that's not a soldier POV. The screens were edited in photoshop.

If that Alpha screen shows actual gameplay from many months ago as claimed, then why did ND need to carefully pose and fake all their recent media to make the game look playable?

 

[Fat Tony!]

So you enjoyed waiting for hl2? It was a pretty poor development process. They just want to whore it out.

 

[NeoNight]

http://www.nuclear-dawn.net/forum/showpost.php?p=22897&postcount=14

more soild proof of the ND conspiracy!

 

[Gusdor]

The main difference between games and mods is that first, games have the Source engine license and increased access to the engine code (since they have the entire source code I believe, though I might be wrong). Second, games are paid, which means they can commit much more time, effort, and resources to making their product.



I love you Sulkie.

Sorry mate, i know you are staff here but you are talking out of your arse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game

First sentence - "is an activity, generally recreational in nature, involving one or more players". As i previously mentioned, Mod is a subset of videogame which is a subset of Game. And, i want to say this for the purpose of clarity, if ND turns out to be crap, it will be game as its casual amusement for me as a spectator. If it turns out to be playable it will also be a game. Hence the term "dont you play games with me boy, or ill kick your ass to mars!"

 

[Asknoone]

Valve didn't photoshop a HUD onto their reference photos and claim they were exclusive gameplay screenshots.

http://www.halflife2.net/news//1151204219_nd_j2.jpg

That is absolutely posed. Probably with static models again.

Since when, in any muliplayer game ever, have three players stood around a door, absolutely still and in an exactly spaced formation?

There's no HUD on the screenshot, the POV is above all the characters, and the camera is tilted to the side.
It's not a "head movement" feature because that's not a soldier POV. The screens were edited in photoshop.

If that Alpha screen shows actual gameplay from many months ago as claimed, then why did ND need to carefully pose and fake all their recent media to make the game look playable?

Twuth!

 

[Ennui]

Sorry mate, i know you are staff here

doesn't mean you should treat me any differently i'm not going to ban you for disagreeing

but you are talking out of your arse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game

First sentence - "is an activity, generally recreational in nature, involving one or more players". As i previously mentioned, Mod is a subset of videogame which is a subset of Game. And, i want to say this for the purpose of clarity, if ND turns out to be crap, it will be game as its casual amusement for me as a spectator. If it turns out to be playable it will also be a game. Hence the term "dont you play games with me boy, or ill kick your ass to mars!"

I generally try to avoid getting into literal definition arguments like this. I should have specified that I know a game like Dark Messiah, SiN Episodes, or even Half-Life 1 is technically a 'mod', but going by the practical definitions, the distinction is that when dealing with things that are modifications of another engine, a game is generally defined by being developed professionally and for-profit, whereas a mod is generally amateur and not funded.

If that Alpha screen shows actual gameplay from many months ago as claimed, then why did ND need to carefully pose and fake all their recent media to make the game look playable?

I'm not touching the rest of this, and I'm not disagreeing, agreeing, or debating with you, but it's possible they pose the shots to make them look cooler. The models could very well be ingame, but these screens look damn tasty, and not just like normal playtesting shots. Whether you are okay with that or not is up to you; I just wanted to offer what I think it could be.

 

[^Ben]

Nuclear Dawn has set themselves up for such a fall it's unreal Hype, hype, hype and even more hype.

This will never live up to expectations - even though it's an NS ripoff(ooh I said it) have fun when it comes out and everyone is dissapointed.

 

[Fat Tony!]

Yeah I don't think it matter which is a mod or not. It looks like hl2 deathmatch to me either way

 

[Gusdor]

doesn't mean you should treat me any differently i'm not going to ban you for disagreeing

Less men would...and have :O

Incidently, the only difference is i dont assume noobishness

I generally try to avoid getting into literal definition arguments like this. I should have specified that I know a game like Dark Messiah, SiN Episodes, or even Half-Life 1 is technically a 'mod', but going by the practical definitions, the distinction is that when dealing with things that are modifications of another engine, a game is generally defined by being developed professionally and for-profit, whereas a mod is generally amateur and not funded.

ok i see what you meant. Perhaps its worth stating commercial title from now on to avoid confusion THats what set me off at least!

Erm, im aware that i havnt really commented on this. AS someone who has worked with source i admit is is FAR easier to wing development fo a game, just ask 3d realms. Whoops thats another issue. Seriously though, i think Its possible, but unlikely that there is NOTHING to show. I tihnk maybe that, as is common, PR advances fast than development. You may remember HL2's devleopment falling into this trap too. aNd that didnt end well in the slightest.

 

[bbyybb]

I cant wait to play this hl2 dm model replacement and map pack...

 

[Ennui]

I cant wait to play this hl2 dm model replacement and map pack...

I can't wait to scream "PWNED" at you.

 

[Sui]

I don't doubt that the mod will come out, but it won't be released for a long time yet. So far I've seen a couple of maps, some player models, and supposedly some spawn points pretty much copied directly from Natural Selection. In order for a mod to be successful, it needs a strong fanbase and a lot of content (varied maps, enough diversity to make every match different). So far, ND seems to have neither. You can't say it has a fanbase, because no one's played the game, and no one knows jack shit about it. There's just a load of forumites who are drooling over ND concept art - and they're not true fans. As for content, the mod doesn't have a lot (otherwise they'd have been plastering us with media), and it's not incredibly varied or interesting. The guns look copy-and-paste sci fi, the player models look cool but all the same, and the environments are incredibly individual (the Japanese map's quality probably won't transfer onto the other maps, if there are any).

MY conclusion is that ND has so substance. It doesn't even have the fundamental features a mod needs - it just has some pretty looking artwork. Of course, I'm sure there's more going on behind the scenes, but seeing as there's only a few identical screenshots flying about it doesn't seem like ND is anywhere near a playable state.

As for newsposting, I'm sure the above could be said about a dozen other mods, all of which we make newsposts about. Just because ND publicise too much, and boast when they really should be modest, it doesn't mean we should hide the mod from the public. After all, by posting about it we've sparked a discussion which is really quite interesting Isn't that what the internet is all about? Apart from, of course, pwning some noobs.

 

[GusTheLegend]

Ok - let's get this straight.

Yes they have great talent in their team, some of the work that's pulled off is great.

BUT THE RESULT IS HALF OF IT IS FAKED.

Photoshopped screenshots gallore. If they were REALLY in some form of Beta / Alpha.

Release a video. * cough *

 

[COALslaw]

Looks good.
I wish they'd get rid of the generic hl2 3d map building in the first pic there. Looks way to HL2 esque.

 

[CrazyHarij]

yay, more pretty still photos that remind me of the stuff i used to pose in gmod

 

[Docm30]

The main difference between games and mods is that first, games have the Source engine license and increased access to the engine code (since they have the entire source code I believe, though I might be wrong). Second, games are paid, which means they can commit much more time, effort, and resources to making their product.

To clear up what I said...

He said this mod has raised the bar for Source, not Source-mods, so I simply stated that Might and Magic has it looking better and it really exists! (ZOMG!). And just because they get paid doesn't mean Mod-teams can be lazy and put out crappy content - mod-teams are should be expected to create games on-par with the pro's.

 

[dfc05]

To clear up what I said...

He said this mod has raised the bar for Source, not Source-mods, so I simply stated that Might and Magic has it looking better and it really exists! (ZOMG!). And just because they get paid doesn't mean Mod-teams can be lazy and put out crappy content - mod-teams are should be expected to create games on-par with the pro's.

I don't agree with that. Mod teams should feel free to experiment with what they do and not think that they have to create games "on-par with the pros." They're not pros; some of them are still learning. It's too harsh to set pro standards for them. I played through a bunch of the student-made mods that have been coming out (like the Guildhall ones) and while they are definitely not up to pro standards, I still found them enjoyable and I think they did a good job with it. Actually I think that's where a lot of the appeal comes for me. It's nice to see something students worked on and think, "Wow, someone my age actually made this and got it to work." It's rather amazing.

 

[alphadec]

These pics or increadible they must be a render

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

I thought I'd just pass on a couple of helpful tips for creating screenshots.

1) Ensure that all testers record demos - a new one for each map played, numbered sequentially*.
2) Assign someone to review all the demos afterwards.
3) Playtest! Cover your testing objectives, have fun, etc.
4) Have the demo reviewer go through each person's demos using the in-game demo viewer UI, making a note of the times of significant events and the player that recorded it.
5) Ultra-high settings time! Put everything on full, at the highest resolution you can. Load up the demos, jump to the pre-noted times and get those screenshots! (note: you can also leave the player's perspective with cl_demoviewoverride_1 and float around for better positioning.). Use cl_drawhud 0 and impulse 200 if you want non-POV shots.

Using this method, you get to pick the best action from actual playtests. Also great for picking up those "Whoa dude! I wish I'd got a screenshot of that!" moments.

No charge has been made for these helpful hints.

*also great for repro cases in the event of a crash - you can see exactly what each person was doing when the crash occurred.

 

[bigburpco]

Who cares, honestly? Stop flaming it and flaming back at those who flamed it.

Who gives a damn, seriously? 'Hey, you faked media. Haha, you suck.' 'Oh, you'll see on release day!' (NOTE: I see all the time.)

Who gives a shit whether they fake it or not? If they faked it and it comes out released, and it's trash, who gives a shit.

 

[marksmanHL2 :)]

I agree with whomever said that they are setting themselves up for a fall.

If this game isnt reaaaaaally reaaaaaaaaaally good on its initial release its gona get a heck of a shitty reputation. No amount of PR will save you...

 

[Double_Blade]

I agree with whomever said that they are setting themselves up for a fall.

If this game isnt reaaaaaally reaaaaaaaaaally good on its initial release its gona get a heck of a shitty reputation. No amount of PR will save you...

I agree with you... So what if the team has a PR? What is more important is the team that is working together not flaunting that they have a PR and be done with it.

I am sorry for the team that had worked hard on the mod. Photoshopped is not helpful in any shape or form, so, if you currently can't finish it up or do anything then don't show it.

It's pretty funny that DaveL have the guts to demand his critics to remove all the negative reviews. You can report me for this, but the only thing I can say is, you get negative feedbacks wherever you go, there is no shame in knowing your wrongdoings.

 

[Kangy]

DaveL is a bit of a joke, he should try leading instead of creating disasters.

 

[ericms]

The main difference between games and mods is that first, games have the Source engine license and increased access to the engine code (since they have the entire source code I believe, though I might be wrong). Second, games are paid, which means they can commit much more time, effort, and resources to making their product.

That's not really the difference as there are plenty of hobby developers making their own engines and games. Licensing and money don't determine if something is a game or not. Do you mean specifically to the Source engine? A mod I would define as an extension/change of game code and as they are building from the game, not the engine.

I generally try to avoid getting into literal definition arguments like this. I should have specified that I know a game like Dark Messiah, SiN Episodes, or even Half-Life 1 is technically a 'mod', but going by the practical definitions, the distinction is that when dealing with things that are modifications of another engine, a game is generally defined by being developed professionally and for-profit, whereas a mod is generally amateur and not funded.

Wait, how is Half-Life a mod?

 

[marksmanHL2 :)]

Halflife is heavily based upon the quake engines. I guess thats what he was refering too anyway.

 

[CREMATOR666]

DaveL is a bit of a joke, he should try leading instead of creating disasters.

QFT :|

 

[ericms]

Halflife is heavily based upon the quake engines. I guess thats what he was refering too anyway.

The Quakeworld engine yes, but not Quake.

 

[Ennui]

Halflife is heavily based upon the quake engines. I guess thats what he was refering too anyway.

Yes. It was part of the discussion I was having with Gusdor, HL is a mod by his definition, though I still consider it a game obviously.

To clear up what I said...

He said this mod has raised the bar for Source, not Source-mods, so I simply stated that Might and Magic has it looking better and it really exists! (ZOMG!). And just because they get paid doesn't mean Mod-teams can be lazy and put out crappy content - mod-teams are should be expected to create games on-par with the pro's.

No, there's absolutely no way you can really justify having a valid expectation for a mod team to create content on par with professionals, for the very reasons I outlined. No mod team has the same amount of time to commit to the mod as a professional team; most mod teams don't have nearly the talent or experience that an industry team does (though some do).

Not to mention that that sort of thinking pidgeonholes modding in with retail gaming, which steps all over our greatest asset, which is innovation.

And Double Blade, remember when I said you just repeat other people's arguments because you think it will make people like you? Same case, here.

 

[Kadayi]

No, there's absolutely no way you can really justify having a valid expectation for a mod team to create content on par with professionals, for the very reasons I outlined. No mod team has the same amount of time to commit to the mod as a professional team; most mod teams don't have nearly the talent or experience that an industry team does (though some do).

Not to mention that that sort of thinking pidgeonholes modding in with retail gaming, which steps all over our greatest asset, which is innovation.

Well said. Regardless of how Pro graphics/models/levels look if the core gameplay experience underlying it is merely generic rather than innovative (or a significant improvement upon what is already out there) there really is little point in making the mod. Success lies in creating archetypes.

 

[Trooper]

As usual, the Nuclear Dawn team never disappoints.

 

[bigburpco]

Beware of flak coming your way, Trooper... :|

 

[Double_Blade]

And Double Blade, remember when I said you just repeat other people's arguments because you think it will make people like you? Same case, here.

Note that I don't seek for attention but I am stating the truth. I don't make people like me because I don't even care and think that it is important at all.

I won't argue any further because you are a super moderator and if I argue with you, it will be against the rules.

I agree right there with Kangy, DaveL has sullied other mods and their teams and attacked them. Anyway, does DaveL have a life? If he has then he shouldn't be forcing his critics in IGN and other communities to delete the posts.

 

[Ennui]

Note that I don't seek for attention but I am stating the truth. I don't make people like me because I don't even care and think that it is important at all.

I won't argue any further because you are a super moderator and if I argue with you, it will be against the rules.

I agree right there with Kangy, DaveL has sullied other mods and their teams and attacked them. Anyway, does DaveL have a life? If he has then he shouldn't be forcing his critics in IGN and other communities to delete the posts.

First off, arguing with me is the same as arguing with any other member. Being a part of the staff doesn't mean I get to ban you because I dislike you or disagree with you. It is not against the rules to disagree, and on the contrary, declining to argue with the excuse that I'm a super moderator is more likely to annoy me then actually arguing is.

However, it seems obvious to me, and probably most of the rest of the site, that you tend to post badly recycled versions of things other people have already said, and you don't appear to really know what it is you're talking about when you say these things. Could you, on your own, really stand up to myself or anyone who supports Nuclear Dawn in an argument? I highly doubt it.

Also, personal attacks on DaveL are not warranted or tolerated. He doesn't get special treatment, positive or negative; personal attacks are against the rules. That means to stop saying he doesn't have a life, comprendes? If you wish to question his integrity or motive in a mature, reasonable way, you are free to do so, but if you cannot without making personal attacks on his character, then that privledge will be removed.