thee. realism mod, how far can we go? who wants to?

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Quotidian---

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Okay this is my take on mods and games.

Games are made to be fun. Enjoyment. It seems to me that many games are created with the idea of 'noobs' in mind. Such that, most on-line mods, you run fast, you can take a considerable amount of damage, your gun automatically reloads and has superb accuracy, or none at all.. you can sprint at 15mph with your colt open wide and hit everything in site, or get lucky.

This makes a game fun for anyone, even the first timers at FPS's.

I've been a gamer all my life, and i love FPS's over anything, and i'm sick of this. Personally i think the more realism, the more 'fun' it becomes.

becuase you have more options and more realistic out-comes. I may have to sacrifice the ability to sprint across a map shooting and dodging.

but it becomes replaced with the over all need for cover fire. You can't run across a field cuase you'll get mauled. in DOD or CS i could easily pull this off.

There are plenty of 'realism' mods out there, and i myself have nothing but ideas to offer to such a mod, along with some photoshop skills which aren't very useful.

But i would like to see a complete realism mod. see how far it can be taken.

This entails: lowering speed drastically. I'll even e-mail valve and find out the real life to game ratio to see exactly how fast you should be able to run in game. But in my experience with my friends testing in servers lowering speed and speed only, once our speed was lower, we had to stick together more, we had to USE everything around us for cover, and move up in incriments.

not to be rediculous this would ential sprinting.. aiming with holding the sites up as an alt fire.

no cross hairs

longer timers on nades, i think standard is 8 seconds? i could find out easily thou.

a new damage system, which real life could be more accurately portrayed in hl2.

I dont' think it would be a WWII mod simply cuase so many are going to be attempted. Although realism would fit well into any settings.. either way, becuase reailsm is what i believe long term gamers REALLY want. and more realistic you TRY to make a game, and the less 'fun noob factor' you incorporate,
then you'll naturally create a fun game. sorta like how if you have a free form AI you don't need scripted sequences.

and you can't tell me any mod active today pulls off realism to a fraction of what it could be. with dod i could name off 10 changes without much brainstorming at all!


anyone else feel the same way?
 
nice post... I think it would be cool to see how far the realism can be taken and make it so real that the gameplay doesn't suffer but instead makes it better.
 
I wouldn't say it's necessarily 'realism' that attracts people, but more along the 'escape' from everyday life. To be able to interact in an environment not likely available to them.

I like to see games or mods with relations to 'realism'. The thing that gets me is that how in many FPS's the player holds the gun at the side about mid torso ad thus is able to kill with precision. It's just a pet peeve I have, same problem with movies.
 
Personally, I dont think realistic/unrealistic is a measure how fun it can be. It is the pace that it sets. Lets face it, we WANT to get excited by games. When you get excited, it doesnt matter if its realistic or not.

If you can make a totally realistic mod that can still make you jump, make you laugh and get you hyped up in expectation for the next battle, no one will care about missing crosshairs or slow speed.

If it does not do this, everyone will ignore the mod, even the hyper realistic fans. We love to play games (and love playing them) for a reason. Realism is not one of them, it is merely one of the many ways to acheive that reason.
 
i agree chu.

one of my pet peaves is automatic reloading... I start to ignore this one cuase virtually every game incorporates it, but then rarely i'll play a game and finish off a clip and nothing happens.. and at that moment, i'm like.. thats awesome

cuase now i have the option not to reload the clip and switch to a different weapon if i'm in trouble or just want to go down my list of weapons and reload all at once, who knows!.

but in games now, you finish the clip it starts reloading automatically and if you switch guns at that point, it just interupts the animation, and usually loads the clip anyway if you switch back. where as i should not have been able to switch weapons since i should have told it to reload.

the list goes on...
 
I'm saying thou that, if we were to make a mod with such a target realism, that- that excitement will just come naturally. you won't have to design it to have excitement.

maybe its just me, but i usually get fed up with DOD / CS becuase every battle turns into a 360 degree battle and i almost always take it in the back, and eventually get mad at my team/ or if i'm doing good, its usually cause i'm running right into people's faces and aim'ing firing first. then whoring them from the spots i obtain in or very near to their spawn..


EDIT:
i'd rather sprint to a bunker with 3 guys, hit the deck and wait for the fire at us to stop, pop up and unload a clip for supression - so teh enemy can't sprint up closer on us. then sprint to the next bunker hoping all that worked, then giving cover fire so my buds from that last bunker can run up and join me. and so on.. actually having "sides"

instead of this, spawn and the guy could be anywhere, maybe even in your spawn, so will all just run our seperate ways kind of thing


2nd EDIT:
but in all fairness.. to make this fun, i'd probably want to incorporate moving spawns. Meaning if my team's front line is 3/4 of the map towards the enemy side, the spawn would be 1/4 of the way, instead of at the very start of our side, and so on. becuase i really wouldn't want to truck down a map for a minute everytime i die, exspecially if i just died and had to wait 15 seconds to respawn.
 
Let's see... a hitbox for each internal organ and some major arteries, blood loss (if no major organs/arteries are hit it can be stopped), crippling injuries, maybe unconciousness from hard blunt impacts to the head (like a crate falling on you from a few stories), dizziness/weakness from blood loss, at least some dismemberment, realistic bullet physics (with an arcing path and a delay depending on the distance), a chance to drop the gun if it or your hand is hit by a bullet, grabbing onto ledges and pulling yourself up, the ability to push people and possibly knock them down, and the ability to get into smaller places by crawling under something or sidling through a narrow opening.
 
Realism doesn't equal fun.

You trade off certain amounts of realism to make the game playable. Most people don't want to have to reload manually when their weapon empties. They don't want to drag their bleeding and damaged body over half a mile of rough terrain hoping to find a medic. They don't want guns that jam in the middle of a firefight.

If you're trying to build an ultra-realism mod, prepare for it to be dull.
 
When you spawn, your gun is set to safety, and you must remember to turn it off, otherwise you risk going into a firefight, and ending up very embaressed.

When you bleed profusely, you can slip up in your own blood.

Firefights give you the jitters randomly, making you bury your head in your hands, mumbling "Mummy...."

When running, you can trip up for no apparent reason.

Upon installing the game, you have to undergo a virtual 'medical', and there is a chance that the doctor will declare you unfit for combat, and you won't be able to play.

Once dead, the game exits, and you can never start a new game, ever.

Just my ideas
 
"Once dead, the game exits, and you can never start a new game, ever."

lol God can you imagine if a game like that was made. I shudder to think what people would do if they hadn't read the instructions, jumped into the game, got shot immediately and were unable to run it again lol

But you did give me an idea, what if the game was setup to use randomly generated character profiles. So you'd start a game playing as somebody, but once your dead your dead, next time you play its someone else entirely (maybe each character has strengths and weaknesses, like how much blood loss they could stand, how many weapons they could carry and it was just random luck if you got a strong or a weak player but never the same one. Maybe some form of dynamic feature in the game, so everytime you played it the game remembered what happened previously, your dead bodies from other games from where you fell.. The enemy aswell as new enemies turning up so you'd never really play the same exact game twice. Traps and things would have to be manually reset (and many made in a way so they weren't a once only affair or later games could get pretty boring)

Ok so wouldn't make for the best game ever, perhaps? But would be different. I've read on here that there is atleast one game which deletes saved games in some way

I like the running and trip up for no apparant reason lol. Maybe after running for a bit you slow down, no human can just keep running at full speed like most game characters can. Or keep hitting things with a crowbar at full force all the time (I think that poke### mod for HL1 had it so swinging the pipe would gradually slow down if you kept doing it)

and yes im aware you were taking the mick with the other suggestions ;)
 
exactly, some of the ideas you guys just listed above were some i've had my own.

i could compile what i would deam the most realistic POSSIBLE game and post later,

like i've said, "how far can we take it" without making it 'boring'. My whole argument is the less noob features we incorporate the more serious gamers will flock to this mod.

i'll start writing up a list i think that we can all tear at :)
 
Originally posted by Quotidian---
like i've said, "how far can we take it" without making it 'boring'. My whole argument is the less noob features we incorporate the more serious gamers will flock to this mod.
Click to expand...
But you assume 'serious' gamers will flock just because its full blown realism? I heartily dissagree!!! I for one would NOT like to play such a mod. And I do consider myself a 'realism' player, nearly every game I have ever played I have tried to mod more 'realisticly' (example, BF1942 without crosshair and much more deviance from moving). Why would I not want to play such a mod? Because no matter how far or little you move towards realism, you already past the gaming fun limit long ago. I have learned that from experience, still learning it every day.
And still, players decide the gameplay. Yes, players, no matter how the mod looks. For example, players can create quite realistic gameplay in Savage (advanced tactics, sneak attacks, large scale assualts, the lot) but the game itself is far from realism as it comes. So is it realistic or not? Beats me. And I dont care. It feels real enough when running with 20 other friends against a heavily defended base, screaming "CHARGE!" all the time. But then again, you happen to be a indian lookalike wielding a DAMN big sword and a rail gun. :p

But its your mod, if you feel its good, go ahead! Any mod that the developer liked to create is a good mod :)
 
I know Steel Battalion (a mech game) for the XBox, which costs $200 because it comes with a special controller, will delete your saved game if you eject in enemy territory and get caught.

That game is only for hardcore fans of mech games.

They designed it to be the most "realistic" mech game yet.
Before you can actually do anything you have to run through a sequence of system checks and flip a bunch of switches on that controler in the proper order and, finally you can start playing.

If you look on the upper right corner of the controller you'll see the eject button which even has the little plastic cover that you have to flip up before you can hit eject.
 
haha my god,

but I don't want to create a SINGLE PLAYER mod, as some of this is starting to be referenced to, this would be multiplayer, hince no deleting of saved games.

and i stated i don't want players taking a full minute to get back into the action. I want the fighting to be as realistic as possible without certian draw backs, which could be implemented to make it more realistic, but provides only negative outcomes - such as long spawn times/long hikes to get to the battle field.

Instead give the player the OPTION to make a long hike completely out of harms way say around some mountian or in some excluded hole in a wall - it was his decision to make this long truck but he rewards himself with a superb sniping spot.

becuase thats another thing about mods i don't like, is the sniping. Its terrible. I have yet to play a game that really introduced the aspect of sniping which provided extra realism, extra challenge, and extra gameplay.

For example sniping in DOD. There is barely a level where you can grab a spot that would shield you from M-1 or k98 fire. Your sniper rifle is useless cuase you get sniped by a thomas from the same distance. Its only FUN to look into a scope, so thats why i do it.

But if accuracy was brought to reailsm. making thompson fire in-accurate at over 100yards,... ... i could go on with an example. But i'll i'm really saying is you'd have to use cover, flank/smoke to get to a sniper, it becomes fun and you have to THINK.. as of right now, if i incounter a sniper, i just continue running like he isn't there, and shoot at him. usually they miss have to reload and just continue jumping/running zigzags firing and score.
 
okay i've pretty much finished typing up this list of a realism mod idea i have.

I really really think i have some good ideas in there, that could be implemented maybe in future realism mods if this one could never get underway.

But the text is rather large, i split it up into sections like fighting/respawn/sniping/movement etc and spaced it all out so it shouldn't be a hard read, but i'ma go over it and make sure its even a nicer read.

Maybe an admin could tell me if i should just make it a post, or upload the text file, if i can do that even?
:)
 
If you wanted a totally realistic damage model I say do away with the health bar and even hit points. Your health should be represented by how tired you are, how blurred and dark your vision is etc... I think a total realism mod would be a good experiment.
 
well here it is, rip bite and tear but not to much, please quote me one whatever you are attacking or complimenting (maybe? lol :) )

i tried to put everything in a section and explain alot my ideas where neccisary. and in reading a few you may say BUT WHAT IF, well keep reading or look at the (see so and so) at the end, cuase i think i got most of those to.

:cheers:

now i wish i could code. too bad i'm only handy with photoshop :-(
 
This kind of mod is something I've thought about since the first HL came out. I had an idea I kind of thought would be neat: A RPG Skillpoint sort of system that marked certain things down such as: Strength (which determines how many guns, how much ammo, and how much armor you can carry), Endurance (how long you can run, how high you can jump, how much damage you take before you are down), Battle Skill (how fast you can aim after changing positions, how silently you can kill with a knife, how quickly you can change positions such as prone, crouch, stand), and lastly the thing I thought might be really interesting, Pain Tolerance.

Now, I want to start a whole new paragraph on this pain tolerance skill because I thought it may be kind of nifty. You take a bullet through the chest yet can run and function normally in most games, but this pain tolerance skill is how well you can actually do that in a realism mod. For realism, the mod would have it where when you get shot certain places there is a direct concequence. Example: You get shot in the head, you have an 85% chance of dying, BUT, you may live. If you live, you have a certain percent chance of being knocked cold, blurred vision, etc etc. Now, the higher pain tolerance you have, the more these effects would be deterred. Higher you go, the more chance you have of slightly blurred vision instead of unconciousness and so on. Now, there'd be no chance of not taking any adverse side effects, but the more pain tolerance, the less you'd take.

To add on a bit, some effects of an uber realistic mod would be getting knocked cold by explosions, shots to the head, or flying debris. Limping if you get shot in the leg, crawling if you get shot in both legs. Loss of aim and use of two handed guns if you get shot in the arm, loss of all weapon use if shot in both arms. Blood loss. Oh, and one more ability given to everyone: If you get knocked out or in a position where you are just crawling around doing nothing, the ability to just end it right there and respawn. Because really, who wants to be crawling around for a game?


Just some of my ideas. :)
 
lol alot of that i incorporated in my description of the mod i'm describing.


Only i don't incorporate being knocked cold, cuase i don't like the idea, its realism but it only adds negatice output to gameplay. since you wouldn't know what happened and just have to wait to get back up.

instead i suggested that shellshock from nades just cuase extreme dizziness/fuzziness (alot of things can do this in my idea)

when your shot in both arms, you can't hold the gun up in iron sites you can only fire from the hip.

bah i could go on, but i just posted it all and don't want to re-type :)
 
Alot of your ideas in the text are in Americas Army, especially the weapon ideas.

I would be very interested to play a realistic mod, as long as it was done well.

The tough bit is making it not boring. When your playing a computer game its hard to give you the feeling that your life is really on the line, this feeling is required for making realism mods enjoyable.

Hopefully some bright spark of a Mod team leader can come up with an idea to make it super realistic and fun at the same time.


EDIT: I just finished the .txt, its very impressive. Some of the ideas in it are great and i think would really help with the realism/fun problem.

Things like the dead body taking hits for yah idea is really what i dream of in games. A hardcore nitty gritty fighting game.

This kind of mod if executed properly could be revlutionary. But this is the kind of mod i think people will make a while after HL2 has come out. You know how hl1 engine is just now reaching its full potential/utilisisation? The mods coming out now have really stretched the engine to its fullest and i feel this kind of 'realism' mod would be like that. It really depends on the moddability of the hl2 engine i suppose.

I give 100% support to anyone attempting a mod like this:)
 
maybe its just me, but i usually get fed up with DOD / CS becuase every battle turns into a 360 degree battle and i almost always take it in the back
Click to expand...

Perhaps you should consider using strategy to make sure your back isn’t open. I’m a seriously good counterstrike player, and I think counterstrike movement is a little slow. In defense of counterstrike & realism factor, if you are running, your accuracy goes down the toilet.

spawn and the guy could be anywhere, maybe even in your spawn
Click to expand...
The way you fix this is you have two separate spawn points, which are decently difficult to infiltrate (or like counterstrike) start everyone at the same time.

My whole argument is the less noob features we incorporate the more serious gamers will flock to this mod.
Click to expand...
Are those features really noob features? I think those are just features which don’t help your game play. People want to have fun in a game, realism or not.




Perhaps your frustration is related to not being a good player (no offense intended) rather than the MODs/games not being good. You seem to want a much slower game, not necessarily more realistic.

My vote goes down as frustrated gamer, not a person with an idea.



Edit: In addition to the last statement, there’s nothing wrong with expressing your frustrations (I even requested people do that for the MOD I’m developing). Just consider if your frustration is something that should be changed in the game or is a lack of skill on your part.
 
hmm.. I see how i could protray that maybe i am not a good player. But i consider myself excellent. I always take it in the back, but i'm still leading in kills in DOD. You should read the TXT i wrote that i posted a few up, if i could edit my first post, i would do so to include that TXT instead.

-becuase in that TXT is where i compiled all my actual ideas for improving and making a realism mod.:cheers:
 
I thought about using organs hitboxes (and when games got advanced enough, actually modeling all of the organs and skeleton) back when I started playing Quake II... so, neener neener!

* In place of a health meter you should have a damage/pain locator that shows the general areas of the body like head, chest,stomach, left/right arm, left/right leg and when you get hit in one of those areas the corresponding graphic would flash for a second... since you can't actually feel the where you were hit.

... that could all be done with sprites... but what would be awesome and go to the next level is if took the time to make a very small version of the player model and show that model in the corner of the HUD in the same animation you are doing at the time (like running, going prone, etc).
Then, when you get shot the little 3D view rotates to the angle the shot came from, zooms in a little bit on the general area where the shots hit, and displays little paintball like splatters of bright color in the exact place where the shot hit (maybe have them fade out after a few seconds), then return to the normal view after several seconds.

It would take a bit of work but the way I imagine it is very cool... but, if the realism is taken to the point where most of the shots kill or cripple you then it wouldn't be worth the effort.

* For snipers, you should be able to rest your gun on more surfaces than just a bipod... like a window sill or a sand bag.

* You should be able to come up behind someone and choke them with "piano wire", break their neck, or slit their throat.

* A fun feature would be some sort of melee attack in which you use your body weight to shove your enemy back.

It would be great when you sneak up behind a sniper on top of a building... and if you miss it you might fall off instead.

* You could do unconsciousness similar to the idea of dealing with a situation when you have both legs taken out... if you want to respawn after 5 seconds you can, or you can try to wait it and hope no one kills you until then.

* I would like to have a climbing button that would be used to slowly lift yourself over things that you can't jump over.

* When riding in a vehicle and the velocity (since it is a vector value it includes direction) changes it should tilt your body (and view) in the appropriate direction.

* After you fire your weapon your ears could ring for a second or two... so that if you kept intermittently shooting at a place where you thought an enemy was he could be sneaking around behind you and you wouldn't hear the footsteps.
 
oh man this will be sweet!

okay-

your health metter thing, i agree full 100% on and will add it to the TXT

your player model that flashes where you got hit. but i dont't hink the second part is really neccisary- you won't survive long enough to look at that stuff. more or less just a directional indicator aswell.. maybe a circle next to your white body, when you get hit, an arrow on the circle points to the direction it came from, and your body turns red where you've been nailed. (since in real life you could tell what side of your leg was shot thus knowing where the bullet came from)

the sniper resting on more things than jsut a bipod.. well what i meant was that you can rest your rifle on anything that you can rest your bi-pod on, but you have to have it deploy'd so you can shoot standing up. this all window ledges/boxes you name it could be utilized. but you still have to whip out the bipod and can't move while its down.

the paino wire thing, well i never bring one to battle, thats more of a hitman/assassination thing

the melee body weight thing, would be tough cuase tehre's no animation for just throwing yourself, i think just smashing your gun in someones face or pistol whiping or charging with your machine gun held sideways works.

but if you wanted to throw a nsiper off a building, i would suggest using your mp5 or whatveer, quickly blast both his legs, then run up and grab him, and drag him off the side. (since when both your legs are injured you can grab people and or drag youself (hince the medic can drag you to safety)

hahahaha that would ebe so much fun!

teh climbing button, i agree someone in this thread said it earlier aswell.. and i just forgot about it, i'll add it.

the car tilt thing, i know exactly what your talking about, but its hard for me to think how it would work, like what it would look like. I don't understand coding much thou so if its possible i'm all for it.. i'll add it as a possiblity type thing.

the after you fire your weapon and things ring type deal, i thought about this as i was writing up the TXT, but i thought no thtas for nades and stuff. but i like the idea of gunfire supressing your hearing..
so instead i porpose maybe that when you are firing your gun, thats all you can hear. as in any background noise and virtually everyone else around you footsteps or gun fire, would be over/powered by your own guns sound.

or maybe a few seconds after firing for awhile you have a compressor like effect on everything around you like if your outside a club how the music would sound, kinda bassy/compressed.. but this effect wouldn't be great, just a small one.

by the way i'm going to add this to the shellshock deescription.. everything goes silent and you have a ringing occurs, and then slowly your normal sound fades in, but its sounds like your standing outside a club, all compressed you know what i mean?

i'm not sure if thats possible or if ya might understand but it hink it would be pretty damn realistic.

this is turning out awesome, i hope we can assemble a team or a team see's this :)
 
Heya guys,

I just read through this forum and I almost fainted. I am the lead of a mod that is aiming to convey a highly realistic modern-day warfare. Although we are still in the design stage the current game design doc contains LOTS of the comments here. I've taken the liberty to copy and paste some sections to give you an idea:

Physics System
Similar to standard HL2's but a little more realistic with less high jumping and stamina system installed. Bullets take time to reach their destination and will drop in height accordingly. Wind will also make a difference to long range sniping and smoke grenades etc. Shooting through doors is also a possibility and would depend on calibur of the gun. All weapons have correct bullet speed, weight, rate of fire and calibur which will effect its path through the air.


Aiming System
When moving around most classes have merely a small dot on the screen from which to aim buy and after about 1 meters this become woefully inaccurate as the bullets go in random directions and recoil occurs. When right clicked pace must be slow and iron sights mode is initiated. Then most weapons are fired accuratly. All weapons are zeroed to their correct real life specification.

Damage System
Each weapon will do varying amounts of damage in their own right depending on the velocity and calibur of the bullet.But more importantly we will be using a damage location system. A hit on the legs means that your pace will slow and you may limp as you move. A hit on the arms will NOT effect aiming for the sake of game play. A head host will kill regardless of weapon.

I am glad I have found people interested in this variety of mod. If you interested It'd be great if you could head over to the site and maybe post your thoughts on the forum's. Its at http://www.nationalcrisis.net/

Thanks

sonofagun
 
did you read about my dragging idea and medics? :)

or the water bottle? and all the blurry/fuzzy vision stuff!?!?

haha i can't wait
 
I don't think this mod is realistic enough. This idea has much more realism:

the first hour of the game is devoted to... PAYING BILLS!! Wowee! After going through them with NO CROSSHAIRS AT ALL, You go to your accounting job!!!! And do someone's taxes!!!!! The AI of your secretary will be ultra realistic!!!! You'll have to aim your pen by itself , no crosshairs!!! Oooh, ooooh, and a depression meter! also, self-esteem stats that can be made higher, RPG-style!!

All those realism junkies won't know what they're in for.
 
ROFL!

The problem with making an ultimatly realistic mod is that you still have to ensure the balance between realism and gameplay. For instance in real combat if an average soldier was shot anywhere they would prbably be out of the battle - this would not make for an exciting game experience.

As a realism game fan i find that striking this balance can be very difficult particularly because the balance is different for different players. At the end of the day people will say - 'If you want realism, join the army'! This is why I am finding this thread particularly useful in the development of our mod!

sonofagun
 
yeah i didn't write up that TXT with just the idea of total realism. Total realism with no features that add nothing but negative results.
i pretty much explained each new idea (not all mine i might add) and why i though it contributed to realism and gameplay :)
But its just a discussion lol, i'm not going to be creating, just putting together a list of all the shit i've been mad with, in games thus so far
 
Originally posted by alco
I don't think this mod is realistic enough. This idea has much more realism:

the first hour of the game is devoted to... PAYING BILLS!! Wowee! After going through them with NO CROSSHAIRS AT ALL, You go to your accounting job!!!! And do someone's taxes!!!!! The AI of your secretary will be ultra realistic!!!! You'll have to aim your pen by itself , no crosshairs!!! Oooh, ooooh, and a depression meter! also, self-esteem stats that can be made higher, RPG-style!!

All those realism junkies won't know what they're in for.
Click to expand...

lmao!

I can just see the really lame and obvious title to such a mod.. REAL-LIFE *groans* thankyou, thankyou *takes a bow and is pelted with veg*
 
Originally posted by Quotidian---
why live life when you can do it virtually? seriously.
Click to expand...

Be careful, if the Sims fanatics hear you they may consider you their virtual god and take you away with them to their plush isometric apartments and cities and build statues in your image

hmm thats not such a bad fate I guess
 
With the dizzyness/shellshocked effect, have a look at the first Call of Duty demo. It has this exact effect at the start if you get to close to a mortar blast. It is done amazingly well and it really does add to the feel of the game.
 
People play video games to explore a dimension more interesting than real-life.

Seriously, the option to make uber-realism games has been in front of every FPS game developer ever, and they know about it. Why do they only adopt so much realism? Game play. Simple as that.
 
Anybody remember Robinson's Requiem? No most probably wont, that was made to be as realistic as possible. It bombed and even its still realistic but less so sequel went the same way. Only a small few die hard gamers played it. It's a fine line between realistic and fun and realistic and not fun
 
read the TXT (on second page somewhere, its attached)i wrote up and tell me that is soooooo ultra realistic that you wouldn't play it.


EDIT:

and other than realism in general comments, i am wondering what peopel thinking about my death/and respawn scheme. its in the text.
where if both your legs are shot out, you have to be on the ground, but can crawl(can't shoot while you crawl) and medics can 'drag' you to saftey (you can shoot while someone else is draggin you) to patch you up (instead of where you lay). but if both your legs are shot out, after 5 seconds of being on the ground your givin the option to respawn. I think is MORE realistic then games, and only ADDS to the gameplay, doesn't kill it cuase its realistic.
And what about the water bottle? more realistic than some magical shot on the battle field, would help with stamina/shellshock..
 
I understand people's concerns about mods stepping over the line but that's surely what we're hear to discuss - where is that line? Surley IMO it is past those of counter strike and day of defeat! But maybe some people disagree - this is where I think developers need to listen to their communities. If people think National Crisis is too realistic we'll make it less and vice-versa. But at the moment we're going for as much of a realistic mod we can without being detremental to game play!

sonofagun
 
I personally think that extreme realism is the nirvana all pc games should try to reach
 
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Tollbooth Willie
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Tollbooth Willie
Tollbooth Willie
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Tollbooth Willie
Tollbooth Willie
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Tollbooth Willie
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TechnoHippyChic
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