Valve Jira Database Accessed Once More - HL3/L4D3/Source 2 Groups Expand

[edited yet again, sigh, that's what I get for posting while seriously jetlagged--although the bit I got confused in the beginning is immaterial to the ultimate point I am making in the end which I still think is spot on]

Valve launched Steam with the CS 1.6 beta (their second biggest IP at the time) which presumably they thought would be sufficient as a killer app, but in fact it took their number one IP, HL2+the new Source engine, for Steam to finally take off and become successful. The lesson Valve should take away from this still is just how much their largest IPs and killer apps are absolutely required for the success of a platform.

Valve will never alienate their present core audience of PC gamers by making them second to any other platform (or subset of the platform, including Valve's own SteamOS/SteamBox), but they could certainly make every other console without Steam second to SteamBox in their war against closed platforms. In this way they could very much tie their next big IP release to being Steam exclusive (both Steam on PC and SteamOS/SteamBox) which would essentially be SteamBox exclusive in the world of consoles.

Since technically Valve still doesn't care about the hardware, they'd probably still be happy to make versions for the other consoles /if the other console makers would let them extend the Steam service to the console/ (the way they did for Portal 2 on PS3). That's the point, they just want to leverage their own platform wherein they have control and which lets them interact with customers the way they want (everyone knows their primary problems with the console platforms has been their closed nature and not letting valve patch and do promotions and other ways of interacting directly with the customers without restrictions). So SteamBox doesn't have to completely defeat the consoles, it just has to put up enough competition/disruption to be a bargaining chip for Valve to try to get the other console manufacturers to let them do Steam-like things on the other consoles, in which case Valve still wins/gets what they want. In some sense this could actually be the full holy grail of what they want. Steam for traditional PCs + SteamOS/SteamBox as a reference spec for multiple competing OEMs producing dedicated hardware (the traditional Windows model, incidentally, from which Gabe comes) + AND at least some set of Steam's services also extended to the other consoles which still won't be going away anytime soon.
 
In at least two ways.
 
DavidR said:
but in fact it took their number one IP, HL2+the new Source engine, for Steam to finally take off and become successful.
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This is flat out wrong.
 
Speaking for myself I had no knowledge of Steam, let alone a desire to get it. The only reason I ever got introduced to it was because I installed HL2.
Omnomnick said:
It is possible. But it is also one of the worst business decisions they could make.
Click to expand...

You joking, bro? It would be a fantastic business decision. It'd be a colossal boost to the Steam Machine project, which, as it operates primarily through Steam, would bring Valve untold billions of dollars if it became a console heavyweight.

So where are the huge losses going to come from? You think people who only have Windows are going to refuse in droves to buy one of the biggest PC games in history because Valve didn't develop for their operating system first? Nnno.

Learn the difference between a "terrible business decision" and something that is just unappealing to you personally.
 
Gloone said:
You joking, bro? It would be a fantastic business decision. It'd be a colossal boost to the Steam Machine project, which, as it operates primarily through Steam, would bring Valve untold billions of dollars if it became a console heavyweight.

So where are the huge losses going to come from? You think people who only have Windows are going to refuse in droves to buy one of the biggest PC games in history because Valve didn't develop for their operating system first? Nnno.

Learn the difference between a "terrible business decision" and something that is just unappealing to you personally.
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lol. "This is flat out wrong."
 
Fantastic response. You've convinced everybody with your eloquent, cogent counterarguments. How refreshing to meet somebody who bases their opinions and statements on reason rather than nothing at all.

jk
 
Glad to hear that Kelly Bailey is back, his music was irreplaceable.
 
Gloone said:
Windows are going to refuse in droves to buy one of the biggest PC games in history because Valve didn't develop for their operating system first? Nnno.

Learn the difference between a "terrible business decision" and something that is just unappealing to you personally.
Click to expand...
It'd be a terrible business decision for Valve, because Valve has been cultivating their image, quite intentionally, as the kind of company that uses value to sell their products, rather than the desperate and underhanded techniques like exclusivity (even if for a short time). It would damage their reputation as a company that only releases products they believe in. Valve is the company that would not release only a quality, high value product when its ready, and so Steam Machines and the SteamOS must survive of its on volition and on its own merit. The name of the game for Valve's business strategy is creating value and being known for it. To pull the bullshit tactics like you suggest would compromise that strategy.
 
Krynn72 said:
It'd be a terrible business decision for Valve, because Valve has been cultivating their image, quite intentionally, as the kind of company that uses value to sell their products, rather than the desperate and underhanded techniques like exclusivity (even if for a short time). It would damage their reputation as a company that only releases products they believe in. Valve is the company that would not release only a quality, high value product when its ready, and so Steam Machines and the SteamOS must survive of its on volition and on its own merit. The name of the game for Valve's business strategy is creating value and being known for it. To pull the bullshit tactics like you suggest would compromise that strategy.
Click to expand...

Replies like this make me wish we had ratings in news threads.
 
The best thing I think valve could do to encourage steam OS instead of limited exclusivity for HL3 or L4D3 is to put their money where their mouth is with steam OS itself giving better game performance.

do some comparison videos(while showing data like FPS) between both OS's with computers using the same specs. let the performance increase speak for itself
 
Omnomnick said:
Replies like this make me wish we had ratings in news threads.
Click to expand...

I agree too.

Gloone said:
So where are the huge losses going to come from? You think people who only have Windows are going to refuse in droves to buy one of the biggest PC games in history because Valve didn't develop for their operating system first? Nnno.
Click to expand...
In the PC world, the steam machine/OS is more of just an alternative giving us more options when it comes to choosing a system and promoting cross platform gaming, not to try and capture and drag people off the windows OS. The real target are consoles obviously and trying to bring people from there to the PC world, or at the very least disrupt the console market to make it more open like DavidR said. If there is any sort of exclusivity it would just be towards consoles, doing it anywhere else would end up being counter productive towards their ultimate goal.
 
Ikagara said:
In the PC world, the steam machine/OS is more of just an alternative giving us more options when it comes to choosing a system and promoting cross platform gaming, not to try and capture and drag people off the windows OS. The real target are consoles obviously and trying to bring people from there to the PC world, or at the very least disrupt the console market to make it more open like DavidR said. If there is any sort of exclusivity it would just be towards consoles, doing it anywhere else would end up being counter productive towards their ultimate goal.
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That's true; Valve could release HL3 for PCs and Machines concurrently, satisfying the PC crowd, and drawing in the console crowd. I still wouldn't rule out that they develop for Steam OS first, though, just to focus the hype on the console.
Krynn72 said:
It'd be a terrible business decision for Valve, because Valve has been cultivating their image, quite intentionally, as the kind of company that uses value to sell their products, rather than the desperate and underhanded techniques like exclusivity (even if for a short time).
Click to expand...
This is nonsense. Valve's titles have had 'limited time exclusivity' since their inception. You're just blind to the fact because, so far, it's been for other platforms rather than your own. Again, you're just conflating your own narrow perception with "business decisions".

Half-Life 2, for example, was developed for Windows. The Xbox version followed an entire year later. It took until 2010 for Valve to release it on the Mac, and 2013 to become available on Linux.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't recall Half-Life 2 damaging their image and tarnishing Valve as "desperate and underhanded".

All I'm saying is that the same thing could happen here, except Valve develops on Linux first, which, as they've made quite clear, they think is better. If the Windows crowd then starting raging at Valve and how 'unfair' it is, well, that'd just reflect very badly on their egos. Valve would be fine. And billions of dollars richer.
 
Gloone said:
Half-Life 2, for example, was developed for Windows. The Xbox version followed an entire year later. It took until 2010 for Valve to release it on the Mac, and 2013 to become available on Linux.
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I don't see how this is a valid comparison at all. Of course HL2 was developed on the PC first. It's not like they intentionally delayed an Xbox release, either. Certainly not as some kind of business tactic. The Mac and linux releases are so completely irrelevant to the point. Nobody expected the game to come to either of those platforms.

We're talking about Windows and SteamOS here, two very relevant platforms and valid candidates. Not the totally obvious PC exclusive release that HL2 was, that nobody was upset didn't come on the xbox for a year, and non-gaming OSes years later.
 
Vegeta897 said:
I don't see how this is the same thing at all. Of course HL2 was developed on the PC first. It's not like they intentionally delayed an Xbox release, either. Certainly not as some kind of business tactic. The Mac and linux releases are so completely irrelevant to the point. Nobody expected the game to come to either of those platforms.
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I never said anything about Valve "delaying" a PC version as a business tactic. I've just been talking about them developing for SteamOS rather than Windows, which would presumably mean the Windows version would follow a short while after the release on the Steam Machine.
 
Okay, do you agree that it would look like an underhanded business tactic for them to release one of the most anticipated PC games on their new-born platform first? As long as this is true, it doesn't matter that it will likely be ready on SteamOS first. Throw in an other couple months of bugtesting and polishing while the Windows version is being finished, if anything.
 
They'd have to be very clear in their press releases. But like I said, staggered releases are not at all new to Valve, so to most people, the complaints of the Windows crowd would just look immature, and do no lasting damage. Imagine if PS4 owners got angry about the same thing; people would ignore them as silly kids, and they'd be right. I doubt they'd even do any immediate financial damage; I don't think even 1% of those Windows owners would be so mad that they wouldn't get HL3 the moment it was released. Add to this the fact Valve is handing out for free the OS that these people need in order to play the game. It's very hard to paint that as profiteering.

All in all I'd imagine this'd do no more damage than Half-Life 2 did by mandating Steam. In other words, very little, and the outraged were small in number and quickly forgotten about.
 
Gloone said:
They'd have to be very clear in their press releases. But like I said, staggered releases are not at all new to Valve,
Click to expand...
If HL3 was a totally new IP, and not a game so many people have been waiting for to come out on Windows since before any notion of SteamOS was in the air, then I'd agree. But we're talking about HL3. It would be new to Valve for them to not release it on Windows first.

no more damage than Half-Life 2 did by mandating Steam.
Click to expand...
Now this is a valid comparison. But a piece of software is much less significant than an OS.
 
In other news: HL3 trademark pulled from the European Trademark website, probably a hoax. Lol.
Vegeta897 said:
It would be new to Valve for them to not release it on Windows first.
Click to expand...
The platform has changed but the general practice is no different.
Now this is a valid comparison. But a piece of software is much less significant than an OS.
Click to expand...
Yeah, but the OS will only be mandatory for a short while, so it kinda balances out.
 
My point is that doing so is creating artificial value for their product, rather than doing Valve's usual method of "letting the product speak for itself."

A simultaneous release is obvious. It would unnecessarily tarnish their carefully cultivated identity, and that is why it would be a bad decision. Regardless of whether or not people still buy this particular game, they will be receiving a lot of bad press for such a decision. That is something that they care about, as evidenced by their hesitation to release any information or ETA on HL3 due to the damage "Valve-Time" had done for their reputation.
 
I don't think developing it for the best system, releasing it when you're done, and then porting it, is creating 'artificial value'. I think it's just... the obvious way to do game development. It sounds like you'd rather they delay any finished version until the other versions are ready. That feels like the 'artificial' option to me.
 
If HL3 is being released on SteamOS, it's going to be on Steam at the same time. It's not like they're going to have separate libraries
 
Er... yeah, the SteamOS game will be on Steam. You realise that SteamOS is... an OS, right? It's different from Windows.

Vegeta897 said:
Being best on a technical level doesn't make it the best choice, when you considering the things we're talking about.
Click to expand...
We were talking about business decisions, and developing for SteamOS would clearly be an excellent business decision. It's pretty much undoubtable that they'll be making L4D3 and HL3 on SteamOS. It'd be insane for them not to. It's just a matter of whether they're developing the Windows version concurrently or whether they'll port it afterwards.
 
Omnomnick said:
It is possible. But it is also one of the worst business decisions they could make.
Click to expand...

Agreed. According to Steam Hardware & Software Survey, Windows OS still in the first place, while Linux OS not even 1%.
http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

They will release the game for all platforms (PC, XOne, PS4, Linux/SteamOS) at the same time.

Edit: I'm so glad Kelly Bailey is back.
 
I would read Willie's join date again if I were you.
 
I don't mean to sound like an expert--and everyone is ruminating on this very notion--but it's perfectly obvious that 2014 is Valve's year. They're releasing their very own shit on their own shit, so you know they're gonna have a game or two to go with it. I expect two games at once, just like Nintendo back in the day with Mario and Duck Hunt. You don't put out a gaming platform, brilliant or not, without games to ****ing play on it.

SteamOS is coming out on the Steam Machines and HL3 will be one of the games to showcase it. Any different business decision they make in unveiling SteamOS and the machines will be a WTF.
 
Steam Machine Exclusive: HL3 Hunt - Forever

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