Good Job halflife2.net

[Geogaddi]

You've made me seriously question my religious beliefs.

I've been born and raised in the heart of the American Bible Belt. I went to Christian elementary schools. Although I don't go to church regularly I do attend a youth group.

Thanks to these wonderful internets and forumites such as CptStern and Mechagodzilla (among others) I've been exposed to intelligent people with different ideas than those which I've been taught. :O

Reading the politics section (although I rarely participate in discussions) has helped teach me to apply reason and logic to everything I take for granted.

I have found many things about Christianity and religion in general that I don't like. Among these are the way that religions are socially constructed to make people obedient and unquestioning (making it easy for governments to slide into authoritarianism, Bush regime anyone?). That and the fact that Christianity is based no scientific facts, and it also seems to be inspired by ancient religions like The Cult of Osiris.

Anyway, I'd like to hear your stances on the issue. State your beliefs and specific reasons why you feel that way.

 

[smwScott]

It's good that you're questioning your faith. I'd recommend you do a lot more research besides HL2.net though ... it's a pretty important aspect of your life.

As far as my beliefs go, I'm an atheist. The reasons are obvious ... anyone who is capable of intelligent thought can see right through religion. I'm not saying that everyone who claims to be religious is dumb; I'm saying truly intelligent people who claim to be religious are in denial/hypocrites.

There is a good case for agnosticism, but I certainly have no need to believe in any sort of supernatural entity (or the possibility of one) to explain away the many things about life we will never know.

 

[DeusExMachina]

Well I do know the big 3 (Christianity, Judaism, and Islam) all take ideas from the ancient religion Zoroastianism (sp?). If you look into it, you'll see basically where half the ideas of the big 3 came from.

I've been agnostic for the past 3-5 years now.

 

[Qonfused]

You've made me seriously question my religious beliefs.

I've been born and raised in the heart of the American Bible Belt. I went to Christian elementary schools. Although I don't go to church regularly I do attend a youth group.

Thanks to these wonderful internets and forumites such as CptStern and Mechagodzilla (among others) I've been exposed to intelligent people with different ideas than those which I've been taught. :O

Reading the politics section (although I rarely participate in discussions) has helped teach me to apply reason and logic to everything I take for granted.

I have found many things about Christianity and religion in general that I don't like. Among these are the way that religions are socially constructed to make people obedient and unquestioning (making it easy for governments to slide into authoritarianism, Bush regime anyone?). That and the fact that Christianity is based no scientific facts, and it also seems to be inspired by ancient religions like The Cult of Osiris.

Anyway, I'd like to hear your stances on the issue. State your beliefs and specific reasons why you feel that way.

Too much CptStern, imo.

Anyway, I, too, was raised on Christian religion but I have come to realize that common sense negates everything in the Bible. The only comeback is "faith" which is ****ing bullshit.

 

[Que-Ever]

It all comes down to whether you want to risk getting laughed at by your friends, or risk getting pwned by god.

 

[delusional]

i gave up christianity long before i started posting here. even though ive argued against mechagodzilla its all good fun.

 

[Aenama]

You've made me seriously question my religious beliefs.

I've been born and raised in the heart of the American Bible Belt. I went to Christian elementary schools. Although I don't go to church regularly I do attend a youth group.

Thanks to these wonderful internets and forumites such as CptStern and Mechagodzilla (among others) I've been exposed to intelligent people with different ideas than those which I've been taught. :O

Reading the politics section (although I rarely participate in discussions) has helped teach me to apply reason and logic to everything I take for granted.

I have found many things about Christianity and religion in general that I don't like. Among these are the way that religions are socially constructed to make people obedient and unquestioning (making it easy for governments to slide into authoritarianism, Bush regime anyone?). That and the fact that Christianity is based no scientific facts, and it also seems to be inspired by ancient religions like The Cult of Osiris.

Anyway, I'd like to hear your stances on the issue. State your beliefs and specific reasons why you feel that way.

I wub you

 

[Stigmata]

I'm agnostic in the truest sense. That is, I don't deny the possibility of the existence of a/many god/gods. It's impossible to prove or disprove the existence of god, so I just don't try.

I was actually Christian at one point in my life, out of what I thought was personal choice. It ended up that I just wanted to be included somewhere

Also, it's my belief that the idea of God "guiding events" to benefit one or more people is not only diametrically opposed to the concept of human thought, it's a stupid and narcisisstic view of the universe as a whole. I won't get into it now, but the basic principle is that religion as a whole is fundamentally flawed and useless.

 

[Glirk Dient]

I am a strong atheist and live in a hardcore christian family. I havent told them yet as they would most likely disown me or make me do a ton of chores instead of going to church. It sucks.

 

[Qonfused]

I am a strong atheist and live in a hardcore christian family. I havent told them yet as they would most likely disown me or make me do a ton of chores instead of going to church. It sucks.

Same. Not so hardcore, but...

 

[Geogaddi]

It's good that you're questioning your faith. I'd recommend you do a lot more research besides HL2.net though ... it's a pretty important aspect of your life.

As far as my beliefs go, I'm an atheist. The reasons are obvious ... anyone who is capable of intelligent thought can see right through religion. I'm not saying that everyone who claims to be religious is dumb; I'm saying truly intelligent people who claim to be religious are in denial/hypocrites.

There is a good case for agnosticism, but I certainly have no need to believe in any sort of supernatural entity (or the possibility of one) to explain away the many things about life we will never know.

Don't get me wrong, I've done research, this site is just what got me started.

Well I do know the big 3 (Christianity, Judaism, and Islam) all take ideas from the ancient religion Zoroastianism (sp?). If you look into it, you'll see basically where half the ideas of the big 3 came from.

I've been agnostic for the past 3-5 years now.

Freddie Mercury....you will be missed.

Too much CptStern, imo.

Anyway, I, too, was raised on Christian religion but I have come to realize that common sense negates everything in the Bible. The only comeback is "faith" which is ****ing bullshit.

Oh no.....the Stern is infecting my blood...I'm even starting to monster quote reply...

It all comes down to whether you want to risk getting laughed at by your friends, or risk getting pwned by god.

Seeing as a large portion of my friends ARE Christian, I'm risking both. I'm more concerned with my peace of mind however.

I wub you

F8ck a cougar and die.

I'm agnostic in the truest sense. That is, I don't deny the possibility of the existence of a/many god/gods. It's impossible to prove or disprove the existence of god, so I just don't try.

I was actually Christian at one point in my life, out of what I thought was personal choice. It ended up that I just wanted to be included somewhere

Also, it's my belief that the idea of God "guiding events" to benefit one or more people is not only diametrically opposed to the concept of human thought, it's a stupid and narcisisstic view of the universe as a whole. I won't get into it now, but the basic principle is that religion as a whole is fundamentally flawed and useless.

I feel the same way. I've always had my doubts, I just didn't want to alienate myself by questioning it openly.

 

[Que-Ever]

How old are you? Move to California. I'll keep you safe :shh:

 

[JNightshade]

My parents started out raising me VERY MILDLY catholic. That is, they took me to church and all that, but still taught me to question authority, to love everyone equally (no matter what some old fart says), and to think things through. Well, it paid off. I haven't believed in god since seventh grade, and I haven't been to church since eighth- and neither have my parents.

 

[DeusExMachina]

Wait, I don't get the Mercury comment...

 

[Absinthe]

I'm an atheist and I consider religion to be one of the most retarded and delusional concepts invented by man.

If a theist is intelligent, it is in spite of their religous beliefs.

 

[Raziaar]

If a theist is intelligent, it is in spite of their religous beliefs.

Well obviously. Being religious has no actual affect on a person's intelligence, despite how you might feel about their choice. Alot of famous scientists were religious.

 

[Absinthe]

Just figured I'd knock that out right away since I've been in a few recent debates where people used intelligent religious figures as justification for their stupidity.

 

[theotherguy]

I am glad you have come to the light of reason.

I too have come from a moderatley religious southern protestant to a full-blown strong atheist. The reasons for this are partially because of the internet, but mostly because of the education I've received.

Anyone who can learn science with an unbiased lens can see that it contradicts the statements in the bible in almost every facet. And science, which is based on experimental evidence and reason, is a far better source than an ancient text.

Every aspect of religion is in fact a finely evolved attribute designed to give itself the greatest number of followers and the largest amount of funds. Religion is a phenomenon of culture, derived from small traditions and folklore that evolved naturally into the life-consuming, super-meme that it is today. If you look at the aspects of religion, Faith, Beleif, Tithing, Service and Submission, they are precisely the kind of aspects used to control large amounts of people and keep them giving their resources to the church.

Faith is an antibody to reason. Faith is the ultimate fallback. You can present faith with reams and reams of data, of evidence that contradicts its claim, and faith will never back down, because faith is the blind trust in a beleif unsupported by evidence. Religion makes faith a virtue, and this is a very dangerous idea. It means that religion is solidified...it can't be moved by reason, unless reason can work at the root of faith itself, and the person with religion sees that faith itself is a fallacy.

 

[Krynn72]

Heres how I see the whole religion thing.

In a nutshell....

People long ago wanted answers to big questions, just like we still do today. We want to know why the Sun is there... why people died, what happens when we do die etc.

Long ago however, there wasn't as large a scientific community and the field was in its infancy. Now that science has come such a long way... religion is falling out. Thats not to say that everyone or even a majority of people are completely nonreligious... just that its diminishing in comparison to a couple thousand years ago. The reason for this is that science is still not capable of answering all of our questions. Indeed, we dont even know where to begin to answer some of the tough questions. As such, people still need the comfort of having answers. So here again we come to religion which can provide answers to these questions using faith.

I believe religions were created by men for two reasons. To provide answers to their societies who felt lost since they knew so little about life. And to provide guidance on how to live their lives well. The latter part has since been abused in my opinion (its hard to think of one war in our history that wasnt at least partially due to religious conflicts between people) and is what has given religion a bad rep.

As science improves and logic and reason become more prominent, faith will continue to diminish.

 

[Reaktor4]

The other day i found this article on the subject, some of you might enjoy it.

Being religious has no actual affect on a person's intelligence

yep, its the other way around.

 

[gick]

Hurrah!

The another victory for logic and reason!

 

[Barney_Calhoun]

The another victory for logic and reason!

And a major defeat for the English language ;o

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Oh shi-

Now who's going to join Christian Atheism in our (my) half-assed quest to kill the world as jesus intended?

 

[DEATH eVADER]

That and the fact that Christianity is based no scientific facts, and it also seems to be inspired by ancient religions like The Cult of Osiris.

Its not that there is no scientific fact in the Bible, is just that its trying to compress billions of years of history into one package. I just don't appreciate people taking the old testement literally. It should be read metaphorically.

I'm not a christian as such, but I am an pseudo-agnostic, in that I believe there is a supreme entity, but that it has a whole universe to keep control, that we are meaningless to it.....at the moment.

 

[15357]

I am a believer in the moon goddess of the Church of the Heavenly Light.



All thanks to HL2.net.












No, j/k.

 

[bliink]

I find it annoying that in this day and age, something that actively rejects logic can still be so popular.

 

[PvtRyan]

I'm agnostic in the truest sense. That is, I don't deny the possibility of the existence of a/many god/gods. It's impossible to prove or disprove the existence of god, so I just don't try.

You can't disprove the existence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster either, are you agnostic towards him? Unicorns? Pink Orcs dancing the salsa in space? Giant invisible whales who only talk to me about brushing their teeth all day?

You're not agnostic towards them, you don't say "well, I don't know if there's a giant alarmclock in space happily singing about flowers, can't disprove it.".

The question "Do you believe in a personal God", is pretty binary, there's two answers. You do, or you do not. There's no "I dunno", unless you're actually unsure about what's going on inside your own brains whether you do or do not. Which would make you clinically insane. To this answer, you can only answer "No, I do not believe in a personal God.", which would make you an atheist.

Another way of asking would be "Is there a God?", where "I don't know" could be a valid answer. But if I asked "Are there dinosaurs on the moon", you would be crazy to answer "I don't know", and you'll most likely say no because there's no reason to say yes. And then I ask why do you make that exception to God but not to dinosaurs on the moon?

I don't deny the possibility of God existing either, but I'm not agnostic. The odds of God existing to me are no better than teapots in space, and I'm a teapot atheist.

 

[Steven]

The only comeback is "faith" which is ****ing bullshit.

Truth.

 

[>>FrEnZy<<]

You can't disprove the existence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster either, are you agnostic towards him? Unicorns? Pink Orcs dancing the salsa in space? Giant invisible whales who only talk to me about brushing their teeth all day?

You're not agnostic towards them, you don't say "well, I don't know if there's a giant alarmclock in space happily singing about flowers, can't disprove it.".

The question "Do you believe in a personal God", is pretty binary, there's two answers. You do, or you do not. There's no "I dunno", unless you're actually unsure about what's going on inside your own brains whether you do or do not. Which would make you clinically insane. To this answer, you can only answer "No, I do not believe in a personal God.", which would make you an atheist.

Another way of asking would be "Is there a God?", where "I don't know" could be a valid answer. But if I asked "Are there dinosaurs on the moon", you would be crazy to answer "I don't know", and you'll most likely say no because there's no reason to say yes. And then I ask why do you make that exception to God but not to dinosaurs on the moon?

I don't deny the possibility of God existing either, but I'm not agnostic. The odds of God existing to me are no better than teapots in space, and I'm a teapot atheist.

You know what your problem is Ryan? you are thinking about god on the same level as an ignorant, illogical and blindly faithful religious person does.

You conviction that god is an angolosaxon with a white beard up in the clouds reflects how ridicoulous your conception of god is, not how ridicoulous the concept of god is.

logic and reason works fine for the things that we can know, but what about the things that we do not know? what system of understanding must we apply to understand that which we cannot know?

 

[PvtRyan]

Why do you assume we cannot understand this 'God' fellow? What grounds do you base that on?

It's simple really, if God is present in this world and can interact with it, science can describe him, just like anything else that exists in nature.

However, if God is not a presence in this universe, and does not have any influence over our lives, he can outright be ignored because he's irrelevant.

But note that God, or religion therefor, never ever provide answers. They merely provide mysteries. Like you do now, mysteries which encourage you to do away with all logic and reason. Saying "well, you can't understand God, because we can't comprehend him!". But if logic and reason can find no evidence to support the existence of God, you can describe him as "mysterious" but his existence becomes irrelevant because he has no influence on this universe apparently. Otherwise we would be able to find it. If you can't understand God, you must at least be able to see the effects he has on the things he created.

As I said, religion doesn't provide answers, it just redescribes the problem by saying "God did it". An 'answer' which can't explain itself isn't an answer. A religion's answer to problems like 'where did the complexity of life/universe come from?' is "God did it". But they try to explain complexity with an even greater complexity. Improbability with an even greater improbability. Because the designer has to be at least as complex as his designs.

Trying to explain the emergence of the universe itself through God is ridiculous. Again, God isn't an answer, because it pushes back the problem one step: Where did God come from? He's complex, super complex and if we must believe religions, infinitely complex. How improbable is his existence then? If we need an infinitely complex being to explain the existence of something far less complex, it isn't an answer at all.

If the existence of life is improbable, how exactly is describing it with a greater improbability (God) an answer? If you don't find the selfemergence of complexity satisfying, why you do try to explain it with another far greater complexity which must also have selfemerged?

 

[kirovman]

I find it annoying that in this day and age, something that actively rejects logic can still be so popular.

Annoying... yet unsuprising.

"well, you can't understand God, because we can't comprehend him!"

There's a fallacy in that too. Appeal To Complexity.

 

[Absinthe]

You know what your problem is Ryan? you are thinking about god on the same level as an ignorant, illogical and blindly faithful religious person does.

You conviction that god is an angolosaxon with a white beard up in the clouds reflects how ridicoulous your conception of god is, not how ridicoulous the concept of god is.

You know, I'm scouring through Ryan's post and I don't see where in the god damn blue bloody **** you're picking up this shit from.

logic and reason works fine for the things that we can know, but what about the things that we do not know? what system of understanding must we apply to understand that which we cannot know?

You mean things that exist outside the realm of logic and sanity? Like square circles and invisible pink hippogryphs? I do believe that the course of action is to completely and utterly disregard such meaningless trash. Because if it can't be conveyed to humans on a level they would understand, it would be a waste of time to trifle with. To accept that garbage and actually try to work into a body of knowledge would require a breaking of the human intellect and all it has achieved.

 

[brink's]

Oh shi-

Now who's going to join Christian Atheism in our (my) half-assed quest to kill the world as jesus intended?

I've read the mountains of anit-religious shit you've posted and I'd say it was half assed?

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Nonono, you see Christian Atheism is a religion I created, based around a loophole in the bible.

The bible says Atheists are foolish, but it does not specifically prohibit them from being christians. As long as you are on Earth, all you need to do to be christian is preach the bible.
Actually doing what the bible says lets you avoid hell, but atheists don't believe in hell, so it's okay.
The only problem is that atheists will eventually be punished by god. But if god does not punish the atheist (with cancer/animal attacks/etc.), then he has god's implicit forgiveness.

Therefore, all you need to do to be a christian is to tell other people to commit genocide for you (but you are not allowed to commit genocide on your own, because only the faithful are allowed to commit genocide. That's why it's half-assed).

Its not that there is no scientific fact in the Bible, is just that its trying to compress billions of years of history into one package. I just don't appreciate people taking the old testement literally. It should be read metaphorically.

In the bible, jesus says, basically, "thou shalt not read the old testament as a metaphor." He also says that you must follow the old testament to get into heaven.

If it's a metaphor, then it's not science. If it's not science, then it can't be trusted.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

I'm an agnostic, even though Absinthe doesn't believe we exist! :shh:

As for whether there's an alarmclock in space - no, I can't prove or disprove it, but I won't rule it out.

My parents never forced religion on me, so I'm quite accepting of it.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[PvtRyan]

You know, I'm scouring through Ryan's post and I don't see where in the god damn blue bloody **** you're picking up this shit from.

That too. I was just pointing out how Stigmata wasn't an agnost, didn't say anything about a white bearded God shooting lightningbolts from the clouds.

And no Angry Lawyer, you don't exist, shoo!

And strictly speaking you should be an alarmclock agnost, but you don't actually believe in it, so that makes you an alarmclock atheist.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Agnosticism is just another word for atheism.

There is a 1-out-of-infinity chance of there being a god, but that is as close to zero as anything can possibly get.

Strict atheism simply looks at that miniscule chance and calls impossible, because nothing in the known universe or any theorhetical universe is more impossible.

 

[Glirk Dient]

Oh shi-

Now who's going to join Christian Atheism in our (my) half-assed quest to kill the world as jesus intended?

I will make sure to stone all the women and children as god intended They dress sinfully and have impure thoughts.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

And no Angry Lawyer, you don't exist, shoo!

Oh shiiiiiiiiiii-

* Angry Lawyer fades away

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Mechagodzilla]

I will make sure to stone all the women and children as god intended They dress sinfully and have impure thoughts.

No, you can only do that if you are a christian!
Atheists are not allowed to do anything, because Jesus said specifically that only those who follow the laws and have faith are allowed to slaughter childrens.

That is why, as Christian Atheists, we are compelled to demand that christians start murdering childrens - but cannot do so ourselves.