U.S. debt tops $14trillion

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WASHINGTON – The United States just passed a dubious milestone: Government debt surged to an all-time high, topping $14 trillion — $45,300 for each and everyone in the country.

...

Remarkably, nearly half of today's national debt was run up in just the past six years. It soared from $7.6 trillion in January 2005 as President George W. Bush began his second term to $10.6 trillion the day Obama was inaugurated and to $14.02 trillion now. The period has seen two major wars and the deepest economic downturn since the 1930s.

With a $1.7 trillion deficit in budget year 2010 alone, and the government on track to spend $1.3 trillion more this year than it takes in, annual budget deficits are adding roughly $4 billion a day to the national debt. Put another way, the government is borrowing 41 cents for every dollar it spends.
Click to expand...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110115/ap_on_re_us/us_debt_wars
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/01/15/national/main7249446.shtml

Thats $14,000,000,000,000.
 
A tough situation for a country so indignant about having to pay taxes.
 
It really blows my mind how eager politicians are to stick their heads in the sand in regards to the budget and debt. If looking at numbers in the trillions doesn't set off alarms and flashing red lights at what point is it gonna happen? And I'm really getting tired of every president acting like the problems of his time are so dire that he must deem money no object. I mean sure its good for our armed forces to be safe but it's a little bit silly to spend billions of dollars you don't have on drone planes and heat rays (and flying humvees?) when you are fighting guys building improvised bombs out of random crap they find.
 
Politicians are just paralyzed, they cant stand against special interest or the defense industry, they just keep every lobbyist happy
 
They really need to stop being so ****ing populist and raise the damn taxes. Obama is the worst of them all.
 
What is the current tax rate in the US?

The UK has just raised ours to 20% tax. To be honest it's not really made much of a difference to my life. The only place I've seen it effect me is with fuel prices. I dunno if this tax rise will help pay off our debt or not?
 
I don't know. Keep in mind, raising the fuel tax raises the cost of just about everything (the cost of transporting goods and services). I wouldn't be as affected as most since my home is my office. That said, I think the gas tax is ridiculously high as it is.

Off the top of my head, what the government needs to do is cut military spending and stop giving themselves raises every year. Who is to stop them? The voters! We aren't doing shit about it!
 
There really isn't a easy solution to this. If we are to get on top of this debt we are all going to have to buckle down, and people are NOT going to like it.

Two major things:
1: Reduce spending. This includes earmarks, Pork, special interest payouts, congressmen's salaries, military spending, and social programs.
2: Revise Tax Code. The tax codes need to be simplified and balanced. It needs to be done in such a way as to promote industry. For some, taxes will go up, for others they will remain much the same.

Basically, everything needs to be reviewed. If a program or tax code is revealed to be inefficient of wasteful it either needs to be fixed or scrapped. There are going to be a lot of people who raise a fuss over this. A lot of entitlement programs are going to have to be scrapped, and people hate it when those are taken away... but they need to grow a pair and realize that a time of crisis requires people to make sacrifices.
 
we should just get rid of the military. problem solved.
 
The Monkey said:
They really need to stop being so ****ing populist and raise the damn taxes.
Click to expand...

Pretty much. They need to accept responsibility and admit that higher taxes all around would be a positive change and not an unreasonable one.
 
We should just get rid of money. Problem solved. World saved.

(it's funny because it's true)
 
If we were to cut back military spending by half, we'd save 800 billion dollars per year, and still be spending three and a half times as much on military than any other nation in the world.
 
We should close the Japanese bases, they're good now from what I keep seeing.

edit: ok they're good, a bit loony but still good
 
Warped said:
We should close the Japanese bases, they're good now from what I keep seeing.

edit: ok they're good, a bit loony but still good
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure we have those bases in order to keep North Korea in check. But in principle I could see us closing down some useless basses.
 
lord_raken said:
There really isn't a easy solution to this. If we are to get on top of this debt we are all going to have to buckle down, and people are NOT going to like it.

Two major things:
1: Reduce spending. This includes earmarks, Pork, special interest payouts, congressmen's salaries, military spending, and social programs.
2: Revise Tax Code. The tax codes need to be simplified and balanced. It needs to be done in such a way as to promote industry. For some, taxes will go up, for others they will remain much the same.

Basically, everything needs to be reviewed. If a program or tax code is revealed to be inefficient of wasteful it either needs to be fixed or scrapped. There are going to be a lot of people who raise a fuss over this. A lot of entitlement programs are going to have to be scrapped, and people hate it when those are taken away... but they need to grow a pair and realize that a time of crisis requires people to make sacrifices.
Click to expand...

Pretty much this. It's totally within the realm of possibility for the U.S. to bounce back from this debt. The U.S. came out of World War II with debt the equivalent of 30 Trillion dollars(!) and managed to turn that around and form America into the greatest economic superpower in the world. That's because the incredible amount of money they spent in building up their industrial manufacturing infrastructure during WWII, underwent a change after the war that saw the industry slowly convert to developing more everyday consumer products that they sold to America and the world.

The biggest problem with this recession and the stimulus package hasn't been the amount of money the Obama and Bush administration spent on the stimulus. It's how much money Wall Street was given that wasn't spent on the stimulus.

Late in December last year, Obama sat down with executives from Google, Cisco, IBM, American Express, Dow Chemical and a dozen other extremely wealthy companies to convince them to unleash the 1.93 trillion dollars in stimulus and disposable assets they collectively have stored in banks overseas, back into the American economy to stimulate growth. Their suggestion was that he lower corporate taxes in the U.S. so they have an incentive to move that money back into the economy.

Now, look at that again.

They very people who were given an enormous amount of money by U.S. taxpayers to stimulate the U.S. economy and create jobs for said U.S. taxpayers, moved that money into overseas banks to raise the value of it and increase their shares in their own companies, making more money for themselves and rewarding themselves with bonuses while doing so. When asked to move that American money back into the American economy and create American jobs, they say "why don't you lower taxes for our businesses", shortly after getting personal tax cut extensions, all while having created little to no jobs with the trillion dollars of stimulus money they've been given.

It's a real wonder why Wall Street hasn't been burnt to the f*cking ground.

Couple that enormous amount of greed with the incompetency of U.S. Senators spending billions of dollars on wasteful pork barrel programs and the billions lost to Defense programs that never go anywhere, and you've got one amazing hole you're digging yourself into.

I think social programs (especially the department of education) should be the last things to be cut, as they are so many other, bigger problems than social welfare programs.
 
Warped said:
We should close the Japanese bases, they're good now from what I keep seeing.

edit: ok they're good, a bit loony but still good
Click to expand...

Those arent going anywhere, China and North Korean naval influence mean they are the only important bases, Germany can go easily
 
It's only going to get worse. America has reached its tipping point a long time ago. It's only a downward spiral from here on. That's what pride, patriotism and greed will get you. And a pinch of good 'ol ignorance to top it off.
 
Be a little nicer to China

Oh, and stop making so many toys of destruction
 
yep lead based toys are fine though, just be nice to flouters of international law of any kind
 
That is literally what America will do, if it is their financial interest to do so.
 
Although 14 trillion is pretty big we are still doing very well compared to other countries:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_public_debt

I would hardly think of this as a crisis. Although the republicans will be sure to pretend that this is one and will hold our government hostage over it within the next couple of months. Obama will then do what he always does, cave. Chances are social security will be the program that is put on the chopping block. If they don't raise the debt ceiling this country will be totally screwed.

And obviously the military industrial complex is highly bloated and people should pick on it, but if we actually cut a significant amount of money from it millions of jobs would probably be lost.

No easy fix to any of this, but I don't think it would be wise for people to treat this as an emergency, it's not.
 
Sparta said:
Pretty much this. It's totally within the realm of possibility for the U.S. to bounce back from this debt. The U.S. came out of World War II with debt the equivalent of 30 Trillion dollars(!) and managed to turn that around and form America into the greatest economic superpower in the world. That's because the incredible amount of money they spent in building up their industrial manufacturing infrastructure during WWII, underwent a change after the war that saw the industry slowly convert to developing more everyday consumer products that they sold to America and the world.

The biggest problem with this recession and the stimulus package hasn't been the amount of money the Obama and Bush administration spent on the stimulus. It's how much money Wall Street was given that wasn't spent on the stimulus.

Late in December last year, Obama sat down with executives from Google, Cisco, IBM, American Express, Dow Chemical and a dozen other extremely wealthy companies to convince them to unleash the 1.93 trillion dollars in stimulus and disposable assets they collectively have stored in banks overseas, back into the American economy to stimulate growth. Their suggestion was that he lower corporate taxes in the U.S. so they have an incentive to move that money back into the economy.

Now, look at that again.

They very people who were given an enormous amount of money by U.S. taxpayers to stimulate the U.S. economy and create jobs for said U.S. taxpayers, moved that money into overseas banks to raise the value of it and increase their shares in their own companies, making more money for themselves and rewarding themselves with bonuses while doing so. When asked to move that American money back into the American economy and create American jobs, they say "why don't you lower taxes for our businesses", shortly after getting personal tax cut extensions, all while having created little to no jobs with the trillion dollars of stimulus money they've been given.

It's a real wonder why Wall Street hasn't been burnt to the f*cking ground.

Couple that enormous amount of greed with the incompetency of U.S. Senators spending billions of dollars on wasteful pork barrel programs and the billions lost to Defense programs that never go anywhere, and you've got one amazing hole you're digging yourself into.

I think social programs (especially the department of education) should be the last things to be cut, as they are so many other, bigger problems than social welfare programs.
Click to expand...
This is pretty much what I came here to say. WW2 was fine for America, but back then North America wasn't rife with corporatism.
 
The American post WW2 economoic boom as based on the fact they were the only ones with factories intact, and as soon as Toyota and Volkswagen got rebuilt, the US car industry started its death spiral. Also alot of Americas ww2 debt was owend by US citizens, not chinese banks.
 
Both social services and the military could be cut by a large amount, and if we kept taxes where they are, it would go a long way towards easing the deficit...
 
Why would you cut social services (that we all payed in to in good faith) instead of raising taxes on the richest Americans? What specific cuts in military spending would you like to see?
 
just a guess but conservatives dont like social security all that much. they'd rather the poor turn to a life of crime thereby giving conservatives an excuse to use their firearms
 
Sounds like both of them are getting it mixed up. I mean welfare programs. Social Security is a waste of resources and income, besides being a ponzi scheme, but we'll never be able to get rid of it.

As for military programs, I'd like to see them kill off the F-35. I'd also like to stop giving funding to the people that have spend millions if not billions every year having the same competition to replace the same gun. All of the entrants are just using variants of the same design as we have now, they eventually decide that what we have now is fine, and then 4 months later the cycle repeats itself. Get the corporate lobbyists out of the military procurement process. Have them choose a program based on it's merit, not it's kick backs.
 
Virus, can you please cut your shit. This is getting really ****ing annoying.

Welfare is social services. If you don't want to cut social security what welfare programs do you want to cut? And you didn't answer why you are willing to cut services the poor need but are not willing to raise taxes on the richest americans. Raising taxes back to what they were under Clinton would gain you more money than any realistic cuts in social services.

For your military example, if you cut the F-35 program you will save around 50 billion. That's like pissing in the wind, in the process you will probably kill a few thousand jobs. How much money do you think your procurement process will save?
 
Ridge said:
Sounds like both of them are getting it mixed up. I mean welfare programs. Social Security is a waste of resources and income, besides being a ponzi scheme, but we'll never be able to get rid of it.
Click to expand...

no I'm not getting it mixed up and you were right the first time: social security is a social service. and how is ensuring people's survival a waste of resources and income?

In 2008, 15.45 million children [in the US], or 20.7 percent, were poor
Click to expand...

http://www.npc.umich.edu/poverty/#5
 
No Limit said:
Virus, can you please cut your shit. This is getting really ****ing annoying.Welfare is social services.
Click to expand...
Would you get off his ****ing nuts dude, it's not the ****ing same. What the hell are you talking about.

SOCIAL SERVICES is not the same as SOCIAL SECURITY. Social security is something every working American pays into with each paycheck. Social services are things like housing and food help for the poor.


Also, I don't agree with Ridge about cutting it. America helps their poor only a small fraction of the amount other countries do (in other words not nearly enough), as it is.
 
VirusType2 said:
Would you get off his ****ing nuts dude, it's not the ****ing same. What the hell are you talking about.

SOCIAL SERVICES is not the same as SOCIAL SECURITY. Social security is something every working American pays into with each paycheck. Social services are things like housing and food help for the poor.
Click to expand...

you may want to read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_security
 
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