Did Barak Obama hear Rev. Wright's inflamatory comments in Church?

[Andrew LB]

Well, what do you guys think? Did Obama hear the inflamatory comments preached by Rev. Wright during his 20 years as a member of Trinity United Church of Christ?


Edit: Oops, mis-spelled Barack in the title.

 

[MFD00M]

Who is Obama and what is a church?

 

[Andrew LB]

Since you think he didn't hear the comments, why else would Obama un-invite Rev. Wright to speak at his announcement to run for President? Sounds to me that Obama knew this guy was a liability from the start.

 

[jverne]

so what if he did hear him? obama seems to know what he's talking, and doesn't look like a religious nut.
any sane person would come to their own conclusion instead of blindly following some idiot.

and besides that reverend had some "good" points about how the US is heavily responsible for 9/11 to have happened. no i'm not talking about being staged but about how the US at that time lead an aggressive foreign politics. and thus pissing off those nuts there in central asia.

and i also somewhat agree that black people are still hugely discriminated against.

the reverend is an idiot for using religion as a medium, thats ****ed up.

 

[jondy]

Well, what do you guys think? Did Obama hear the inflamatory comments preached by Rev. Wright during his 20 years as a member of Trinity United Church of Christ?

Why does it matter?

 

[Mr Stabby]

Obama is secretly a Muslim black supremacist and Osama bin Laden is his brother.

 

[Eejit]

Why does it matter?

This.

Who cares whether he heard or not?

 

[kirovman]

I'm not sure that I understand why this question is important.

 

[Krynn72]

Because idiotic people think that Obama must agree with everything his preacher says. I think he may have heard them, but i also believe that nothing Barack has done or said leads me to think that Barack believes any of it. Its just people grasping at straws trying to find some end-all reason to "prove" Barack is some white-hating black supremacist.

 

[Zeus]

Well I'm sure he heard the comments, while I think they're totally absurd and offensive I don't think Obama agrees with most of the crap that comes out of Wright's mouth.

 

[Sulkdodds]

I once heard a guy say that all muslims should be shot.

I heard him say it!

 

[Krynn72]

I once heard a guy say that all muslims should be shot.

I heard him say it!

If you heard him say it, THEN YOU MUST BELIEVE IT TOO!

Now I heard you say it! SHIT IM A RACIST NOW.

 

[Kadayi]

I find it insane the extent to which presidential candidates will go to in order to slander or undermine each other for an advantage. Clinton is completely undermining the Democrats by refusing to throw in the Towel I feel. That she lacks the good grace to concede defeat is indicative of exactly why she shouldn't be given the reins. She'll never admit to her mistakes and that is a dangerous thing.

 

[mastag]

I find it insane the extent to which presidential candidates will go to in order to slander or undermine each other for an advantage. Clinton is completely undermining the Democrats by refusing to throw in the Towel I feel. That she lacks the good grace to concede defeat is indicative of exactly why she shouldn't be given the reins. She'll never admit to her mistakes and that is a dangerous thing.

The sad thing is, slander and undermining work. I know lots of people who will not vote for Obama because of those emails(which were proven false)that said that he was sworn in the senate by the Quran.

 

[lame-o]

Because idiotic people think that Obama must agree with everything his preacher says. I think he may have heard them, but i also believe that nothing Barack has done or said leads me to think that Barack believes any of it. Its just people grasping at straws trying to find some end-all reason to "prove" Barack is some white-hating black supremacist.

Well it seems to be working isn't it? It's like people want Obama to be bad.

 

[Andrew LB]

so what if he did hear him? obama seems to know what he's talking, and doesn't look like a religious nut.
any sane person would come to their own conclusion instead of blindly following some idiot.

Well if Obama's true views are anything like his Wife's, I'd say he's right up there with Rev. Wright.

Why you might ask? Try reading Michelle Robinson's senior thesis from Princeton. It's 98 pages, but you'll get the gist of it after the first 10.

and besides that reverend had some "good" points about how the US is heavily responsible for 9/11 to have happened. no i'm not talking about being staged but about how the US at that time lead an aggressive foreign politics. and thus pissing off those nuts there in central asia.

We had aggressive foreign policy during the Clinton years? Wow... thats news to me.

Fyi... the 9/11 plot was conceived in early 2000, long before Bush ever got into office.

If you consider how Clinton didn't do crap about the USS Cole bombing, or the first WTC bombing, or the dozen or so other attacks against the US and it's interests during his presidency, you could be right. The truth is that we took hit after hit during the 90's and I think the most we did was send over a few cruise missiles that accomplished nothing.

If thats aggressive foreign policy.... i'd hate to see what isn't.

Because idiotic people think that Obama must agree with everything his preacher says. I think he may have heard them, but i also believe that nothing Barack has done or said leads me to think that Barack believes any of it. Its just people grasping at straws trying to find some end-all reason to "prove" Barack is some white-hating black supremacist.

trying to find out more about Barack Obama's personal views is 100% open season considering he running for the most important job in the world.

As for your comment regarding racism, I'm only letting you guys see the facts and let you decide for yourself if he has any resentment against white people.

His wife clearly does, read her senior thesis.

Well I'm sure he heard the comments, while I think they're totally absurd and offensive I don't think Obama agrees with most of the crap that comes out of Wright's mouth.

Then why would he spend 20 years in a church where his "spiritual mentor" spewed that crap? Perhaps he figured being a part of that church would be politically expedient for him?

I find it insane the extent to which presidential candidates will go to in order to slander or undermine each other for an advantage. Clinton is completely undermining the Democrats by refusing to throw in the Towel I feel. That she lacks the good grace to concede defeat is indicative of exactly why she shouldn't be given the reins. She'll never admit to her mistakes and that is a dangerous thing.

Since nobody is going to defend Hillary, I'll play devils advocate.

Hillary has continued to stay in the race because it's clear that neither candidate will be able to reach the magic number of 2025 delegates prior to the Democratic Convention. The super-delegates she is trying to move to her side were placed there by the DNC for the sole purpose of allowing them to choose which candidate is more "electable" when it comes down to the general election.

Also, if you were to count ALL the votes that have been cast in each primary, Hillary would have more of the popular vote than Obama AND she would be far closer to Obama in the total amount of pledge delegates.

Taking those reasons into account is what she hopes the super-delegates will do when deciding which candidate is more viable to run against McCain. And considering Hillary has been way up in the polls this past month, if she continues to do well, she will have a very solid argument to why the super-delegates should nominate her.

The sad thing is, slander and undermining work.

The Reverend Wright situation is anything but 'slander'.

I know lots of people who will not vote for Obama because of those emails(which were proven false)that said that he was sworn in the senate by the Quran.

I agree. Those e-mails containing flat out lies about Obama are extremely low handed.

Interesting that the source of those e-mails came from the Clinton-Machine.

I think I'm starting to think that Hillary knows she wont get the nomination, so is instead hell bent on making sure Barack Obama loses the election to McCain. At that point, she'd only have to wait 4 years to run against McCain in 2012 with the confidence of saying "you should have voted for me in 2008, i would have beat him".

Well it seems to be working isn't it? It's like people want Obama to be bad.

I don't want anyone to be bad. But I do want to know as much as I can about a man (or woman) who wants to become the President of the United States. Not much is known about Barack Obama, which reminds me far too much of Jimmy Carter before he was put in the White House.

Barack needs to show the American people that he can handle the most important job in the world. And right now, he's doing a horrible job at it.

 

[Absinthe]

Trying to pass off this witch hunt as legitimate inquiry is a joke. Obama has never said or done anything to suggest he has a grudge against white people or that he secretly hates America. You have the words of one pastor, whose words Obama has now come out to condemn and disagree with twice. What exactly is the intimate knowledge you need? Does Obama need to shoot Wright for you? Would that makle you trust him a bit more?

You are not getting to the heart of any controversy. You are perpetuating it. The only reason anybody's actually making a big deal out of this, and the only reason the media has endlessly recycled clips of Wright looking like a loon, is because instead of a white volatile religious nut, he's black instead.

There would be cause for alarm if there was some actual evidence that Wright had any significant relevance to the campaign, but he is alone. That Obama went to the church and may have heard the man doesn't amount to anything IMO.

 

[No Limit]

It's been so long since we've had an active right wing hack on these message boards, feels pretty good.

 

[Andrew LB]

Trying to pass off this witch hunt as legitimate inquiry is a joke.

You want to know why this is legitimate? Because Barack Obama is a great unknown in politics, and it's quite apparent the more we learn about him, the more things start to come together.

What things you might ask? Well my biggest issue with the Senator is that if he is the great uniter as he claims to be, and that he transcends race... why is it that he surrounds himself with extremely controversial figures?

- Spending 20 years in a church with a complete racist and nut-job, Jeremiah Wright causes most Americans to question Obama's honesty.

- Being friends with William Ayers, a unrepentant terrorist who bombed NYC police headquarters, the Capitol Building, and the Pentagon.

- Having a wife who clearly has plenty of racist views. (read her senior thesis)

- Obama's own recorded comments from a "closed doors" meeting with San Francisco leftists where Obama himself shows us he's an elitist and has serious issues with white working class Americans.

 

[Andrew LB]

The only reason anybody's actually making a big deal out of this, and the only reason the media has endlessly recycled clips of Wright looking like a loon, is because instead of a white volatile religious nut, he's black instead.

If Barack Obama's pastor was a white man and made these same (or similar) comments, it would be just as much of an issue with Americans.

 

[Sulkdodds]

How big of an issue has it been that McCain has been in bed with Jerry Falwell?

- Having a wife who clearly has plenty of racist views. (read her senior thesis)

- Obama's own recorded comments from a "closed doors" meeting with San Francisco leftists where Obama himself shows us he's an elitist and has serious issues with white working class Americans.

Some of this might want to be quoted and/or sourced.

 

[Kadayi]

It's been so long since we've had an active right wing hack on these message boards, feels pretty good.

I can't say I've missed the absence myself.

 

[Andrew LB]

How big of an issue has it been that McCain has been in bed with Jerry Falwell?

I don't believe that McCain spent 20 years in Jerry Falwell's pews listening to his racist rants, then calling him his "spiritual mentor", among other things.

Some of this might want to be quoted and/or sourced.

Sure thing.

Michelle Robinson's senior thesis: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/thesis.asp

Barack Obama's San Francisco comments: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMkQ6OPi3RU

 

[Andrew LB]

I can't say I've missed the absence myself.

So you'd rather just have the self perpetuating leftist circle-jerk continue on and never hear what the other 50% of Americans think? Pretty closed minded if you ask me.

You'll eventually find that knowing both sides of an issue instead of the closed minded view of just one side is required if you ever want to promote your own ideology onto others.

"Know your enemy" - Sun Tzu's The Art of War

 

[No Limit]

So you'd rather just have the self perpetuating leftist circle-jerk continue on and never hear what the other 50% of Americans think? Pretty closed minded if you ask me.

You'll eventually find that knowing both sides of an issue instead of the closed minded view of just one side is required if you ever want to promote your own ideology onto others.

"Know your enemy" - Sun Tzu's The Art of War

50% of americans? I think you are delusional if you think 50% of americans believe the shit you are spewing.

I don't believe that McCain spent 20 years in Jerry Falwell's pews listening to his racist rants, then calling him his "spiritual mentor", among other things.

The relationship Obama had with his pastor was a personal one. Anyone that has ever been a part of a church in their community knows what that's like. Nobody agrees with everything their pastor says, but the church is much bigger than the pastor itself. You say 20 years like he said these things every minute of those 20 years. The media has only been able to dig up about 5 or 6 "offensive" clips from those 20 years. What's your point? But again, in the end attending that church has absolutely nothing to do with your political views, it is purely personal.

McCain instead took it upon him self to align himself with people such as Falwell, and pat robertson, and that other hagee asshole politically. That means it is not a personal relationship, it is a relationship that directly influances his policies. Why you would pretend that this is somehow better is beyond me.

And what do you think of Billy Graham? You know, the guy that said Jews are destroying this country? You know, the guy that has been a spiritual advisor to virtually every president since Nixon and is considered a hero to many of these presidents?

Or does that not bother you because Graham is a white guy?

 

[CptStern]

heavily filtered through your partisan lens no doubt ..in other words "fair and balqalnced", right?

you're just regurgitating what every other right wing troll has been yammering about over the last 4 years..they usually end up dropping out the community mostly because their knowledge only extends as far as their party's rhetoric does

 

[No Limit]

Sure thing.

Michelle Robinson's senior thesis: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/thesis.asp

Which parts do you disagree with her on?

Barack Obama's San Francisco comments: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMkQ6OPi3RU

You do know that he was correct in saying that, right? When the government doesn't work and everyone is losing their jobs (like has been happening for the last 8 years under Bush) people cling to social issues such as religion, guns, or immigration. In the 90s when the economy was doing good (under Clinton incase you don't recall) people talked about much more important issues than someone's religion, middle name, or immigration.

 

[Sulkdodds]

Sure thing.

Michelle Robinson's senior thesis: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/thesis.asp

Barack Obama's San Francisco comments: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMkQ6OPi3RU

Have you even clicked your own links?

The contraversial phrase in Robinson's senior thesis refers to the views of other people.
So does the contraversial phrase in Obama's discourse - it refers to views with which he contractis and implicitly disagrees with.

This is pathetic. I was expecting something good and juicy.

 

[Andrew LB]

50% of americans? I think you are delusional if you think 50% of americans believe the shit you are spewing.

58% Say Obama Denounced Wright for Political Convenience, not Outrage

The media has only been able to dig up about 5 or 6 "offensive" clips from those 20 years. What's your point?

I take it you missed Rev. Wright's media tour last weekend? It re-affirmed everything said about wright's nut-job views.

And what do you think of Billy Graham? You know, the guy that said Jews are destroying this country? You know, the guy that has been a spiritual advisor to virtually every president since Nixon and is considered a hero to many of these presidents?

Or does that not bother you because Graham is a white guy?

George W. Bush and his father's spiritual advisor is Rev. Kirbyjon Caldwell.

As for Billy Graham, pretty much every president in the last 40 years has associated with him, not just Republicans. He and the Clintons were also close. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1650798,00.html

Putting blind association between "All republicans and Billy Graham" is about as disingenuous as the people who claim Bill Clinton's spiritual advisor is Rev. Wright. Heck, the photo proves it!!!

 

[Andrew LB]

Have you even clicked your own links?

The contraversial phrase in Robinson's senior thesis refers to the views of other people.
So does the contraversial phrase in Obama's discourse - it refers to views with which he contractis and implicitly disagrees with.

This is pathetic. I was expecting something good and juicy.

I never read the "snopes review" of the thesis. I read the thesis itself. I suggest you do the same.

And in regards to the audio tape.... if that were the case, why didn't Obama ever clarify it as such?

 

[Solaris]

Then you need to source the thesis?

And what about the thesis is so outragous?

 

[Sulkdodds]

I never read the "snopes review" of the thesis. I read the thesis itself. I suggest you do the same.

And in regards to the audio tape.... if that were the case, why didn't Obama ever clarify it as such?

He doesn't need to clarify anything, because he was perfectly clear the first time. It really is blatantly obvious from the video what he was saying, and it must take quite a stern deafness to linguistic orthodoxy in order to fail to perceive his meaning. This is not a case where reading between the lines is necessary.

Similarly, the snopes page quotes in full the passage from which the disputed phrase comes from, and shows how the disputed phrase need not be disputed at all. In the absence from snopes of anything more objectionable, perhaps you can quote the really interesting parts of the full thesis, for those of us who have neither the time nor the inclination to trawl through the years-old university work of a politician's wife.

As it is, the links you've given have actually contradicted your own claims.

 

[Andrew LB]

^^^ I wont do your own homework for you. If you don't want to read the thesis, then please don't act like you know what is said in it.

 

[Sulkdodds]

I feel no responsibility to read the whole thesis. You have made an assertion (that it is vile). I have asked you to provide a source. I have read the source. The source has contradicted your original claim. Who here has not done what is required of them? I have read what you provided us with and found it wanting; the burden of proof remains yours, yet stands unfulfilled.

 

[Eejit]

Sulk can we get a 3rd option of some kind in the poll please?

 

[CptStern]

how about "who ****ing cares"?

 

[Eejit]

Or "I really don't think it matters, and anyone who thinks it does is a prick"?

 

[CptStern]

"this story only interests people with an axe to grind with OSAMA HUSSEIN OBA-MAMA-TERRORIST, all other thinking rational people can ignore this thread"

 

[Sulkdodds]

That reminds me.

As for Billy Graham, pretty much every president in the last 40 years has associated with him, not just Republicans. He and the Clintons were also close. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1650798,00.html

Putting blind association between "All republicans and Billy Graham" is about as disingenuous as the people who claim Bill Clinton's spiritual advisor is Rev. Wright. [/img]

Lucky that No Limit made no such association. Indeed, his post that you quote does not actually mention the word 'republican'. His exact words are: "virtually every president since Nixon"...which is almost exactly what you said.

You have not at all responded to your opponents, preferring to unceremoniously pull a straw man out of your arse and stuff it in their mouth. Your post says exactly the same thing as No Limit's, only you represent it like you're arguing with him and he's in the wrong. You also completely fail to address his argument, making your contribution to the thread increasingly seem an exercise in waste.

Is this wild misrepresentation going to become a habit with you?

 

[No Limit]

58% Say Obama Denounced Wright for Political Convenience, not Outrage

That has nothing to do with what I said. I said there is no way in hell 50% of the people in this country agree with the idiotic talking points that you have posted. One would have to be delusional to not see through your bullshit talking points.

I take it you missed Rev. Wright's media tour last weekend? It re-affirmed everything said about wright's nut-job views.

Which remarks from last week do you think were racist or otherwise offensive?

George W. Bush and his father's spiritual advisor is Rev. Kirbyjon Caldwell.

Who cares? That has nothing to do with my point.

Putting blind association between "All republicans and Billy Graham" is about as disingenuous as the people who claim Bill Clinton's spiritual advisor is Rev. Wright. Heck, the photo proves it!!!

Are you really that partisan that you think I give a shit? I never mentioned republicans, I said, and I quote:

You know, the guy that has been a spiritual advisor to virtually every president since Nixon

I never said every republican president, I simply said every president.

But you don't seem to understand. The point is not that Democrats and Republicans associated with Graham, so let me try to explain it a little better.

Wright has made headlines every day for the last 8 weeks. Every ****ing day for the last 8 weeks I've had to hear the same 6 clips repeated over and over and over and over again. Eating breakfast before work, same story. Watching the nightly news, same story. Pick up a newspaper, Wright is on the front page.

Yet, Graham's outrageous comments nobody seems to remember because they weren't reported on that much even though those comments were not only made on tape but before that tape became public he lied about it. No president had to explain their relationship to Graham as a result of his comments. John McCain does not have to explain his POLITICAL association with people like Graham, Pat Robertson, or any of these other whackos that have said things that have been just as offensive as what Wright has said.

So why is that? The only difference here is that Wright is black. The media is trying to bring up images of a scary black man to scare white voters in to voting how they want. That's why Wright has been the story for the last 8 weeks while everyone else that has said similar things got a pass.

And finally, you are not addressing why having a personal relationship (you know, relationships all of us have) with a crazy person is worse than having a political relationship with a crazy person? My dad has political ideas which are almost polar opposites of mine. I don't have to explain that since our relationship is personal. While McCain has no personal relationships with these people but he chose to seek a political relationship with them which will directly affect his policies. Don't ignore this, I need you to explain this to me.