Do Gooders of VT.net, why do you obey your moral compass?

[BabyHeadCrab]

Who here considers themselves a good person? Why?

What dictates your moral code? What do you hope to achieve from obeying such laws. Maybe you don't kill people, maybe you don't steal, never coerce or cheat or over-indulge. Maybe you consider adultery appalling. Perhaps you have opinions that you believe put you on a higher moral ground than a large proportion of the society you know. Abortion, gun laws, death penalty, etc.

I suppose I'm speaking in more day to day terms. Behavior that others witness. Not just to your superiors but to those you can potentially abuse.

What reason do you have to behave in a way most would observe as "good." Do you believe you live up to your own moralities?

Is it God? Belief that it will get your further in life? Do you derive thrill when you help others? Do you believe one needs a sort of formal doctrine to begin the development of a code other than witnessing behaviors?

Perhaps you just don't fancy jail. But that's an extreme. What is it?

 

[JUL3]

Me personally? Born and raised a Buddhist, I try, as best I can, to follow the principles taught in Buddhism.

 

[15357]

I obey my moral compass simply because I believe it's right. I have come up with a logic for my behavior -- humans are social, a society needs willing participation of members to function correctly (and vice versa) therefore it is better for myself to act for society. But things like sacrifice, risking your assets and health for "the greater good" is... based on faith. Not religious, but more like a belief in the absolute rightness of society. Of the "State". Of Government (as a whole, not politically). There is a logic to this, as stated above, but it's mostly faith. I don't believe in God, but I believe in Good as an absolute.

What I consider good is dictated by my own gut feeling, 2 decades of confucian indoctrination, and a lifetime in the machine that is the education system. Also I believe most laws (especially criminal) are good by virtue of being laws -- laws help society function, society helps people survive.

I like helping people because it makes me feel that I'm needed. I have a deep fear of being useless. There is a selfish joy in helping others -- I can assure myself that I am useful to others in a meaningful way and also others can observe me being useful to others.

Also I hate that really guilty feeling when you do something wrong.

 

[Bad^Hat]

Because it's much more comfortable to live within the constraints placed upon oneself by their environment.

Nihilism! Haha.

For reals though I try to think less in terms of GOOD and BAD and more in terms of acting empathetically and judging things by their impact. The one thing I try to carry around with me in my interactions with other people is that we all share the same basic consciousness. And yeah you can pull that smug "lol some more than others" line but ultimately you'd be hard pressed to find a human being who doesn't feel pain, doesn't have insecurities, doesn't feel uncomfortable or unsatisfied with their state of being in some way. So to answer the question, I mostly try to act out of familiarity and common interest. Try to. It's actually remarkably difficult to keep that whole consciousness business in mind sometimes, particularly when I'm in certain depressed or otherwise self-absorbed moods, or if the other person is being a massive dick in which case **** that hypothetical person anyway.

Edit: Of course this is all a bit idealistic. In more practical terms, guilt has a pretty big influence on many of my moral decisions. Nobody wants to be a dick.

 

[Edeslash]

Does it make me naive if I don't care and just live my life?

 

[Krynn72]

I try to estimate the quantifiable impact of an action on people's health/enjoyment of life. If it makes it more enjoyable or healthier for the vast majority of the people involved, then I consider it good and will act accordingly. Science is my moral compass!

This guy put into words how I've been living for many years, and explains it much better. Everyone interested in this subject should read his book.

 

[Stylo]

Meh, good, bad, I usually just do what seems fair.

 

[ríomhaire]

My moral code is basically: "Don't be a prick." There's enough misery in the world without me causing any more of it. I want to help people because that's part of not being a prick.

 

[MuToiD_MaN]

Do unto others, brah.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

My moral code is "do what benefits me first, do what benefits everyone else only if they matter that much to me."

 

[Remus]

Meh, good, bad...

"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun."

 

[Raziaar]

I treat people like I would want them to treat me. Everybody at my work knows I am a hardworking, caring and nice individual. They in turn view and treat me better.

 

[Danny_ZQ]

I was going to make a joke about a "moral compass" being a compass that you bring on camping trips, but now I realize that this is a serious thread, and this is a serious time.

 

[Stylo]

"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun."

This is what I wish I'd have put. Damn it, Remus!

 

[sinkoman]

Who here considers themselves a good person? Why?

What dictates your moral code? What do you hope to achieve from obeying such laws. Maybe you don't kill people, maybe you don't steal, never coerce or cheat or over-indulge. Maybe you consider adultery appalling and. Perhaps you have opinions that you believe put you on a higher moral ground than a large proportion of the society you know. Abortion, gun laws, death penalty, etc.

I suppose I'm speaking in more day to day terms. Behavior that others witness. Not just to your superiors but to those you can potentially abuse.

What reason do you have to behave in a way most would observe as "good." Do you believe you live up to your own moralities?

Is it God? Belief that it will get your further in life? Do you derive thrill when you help others? Do you believe one needs a sort of formal doctrine to begin the development of a code other than witnessing behaviors?

Perhaps you just don't fancy jail. But that's an extreme. What is it?

I'm just over it. I already had my fun. I've already done most of the drugs I wanted to experiment with, and then a few more that I never even imagined myself doing. I've stolen a decent amount of shit, and have ****ed a bunch of people over, for no reason other than personal gain.

I was never much of a "rebel", and I don't claim to be a "badass", not by a longshot. Never have been, and I doubt I ever will be. But I think there's still something to be said about the things i've done. Maybe I was just trying way too hard to be cool. **** if I know. But I was never a very "good" person, that's for sure. Maybe a bit of a pussy and a pushover though. Maybe that's how I justified doing all those things.

I think i've come to the conclusion that constantly seeking "a good time" isn't always the most gratifying thing in the world. These days, I find myself sitting in front of a computer 90% of the time, doing what most people would probably consider "work". But honestly, it's a hell of a lot more fulfilling/engaging - and consequentially entertaining - than to always be gallivanting about and being a total shitstain.

I'm still a total dick when i'm out riding my bicycle and motorcycle though. I try not to be, but sometimes I just wind up having so much fun that I can't help it if I ride like an asshole!

I guess the TL;DR (IE non melodramatic and douchey) version is that my life wasn't going anywhere with the whole "**** everything do drugs and live life" attitude, and that I've honestly been having a much better time keeping my head down and just trying to get my shit in order. I still try to go out and do "fun" stuff every once and a while, but I never do seem to really enjoy myself. Half the time I just wind up an anxious mess, and the other half of the time i'm just a total space case, where my mind is still so wrapped up in other things that it's just like, what's the point?

 

[TechnoHippyChic]

My moral compass obeys me.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

the b oinly ruight answqwer is to do what benefgits you

WAKER ULP PEOPLE

YOU F*CKING IDIOTS

THBSUI IS A RACE

YFIUU FINISHN FIRST

OR FINISH KLASTY
LAST

THE ONLY WYA TIO WIN IS DOP FOR YOURSELF

EVERYONE SECOND

YOUR MORALSD ARE YOUJR DEVILS

WAKE THE HELL UP

N O LE COMPARWE IT IS YOU

WE ARE ALL BOING TO DIEE

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

A [wo]man chooses, a slave obeys. Seriously though, myself personally, I think I'm more of that indulgent phase but am teetering onto considering it downright boring and depressing. I'm gradually heading towards that wake up call. Actually--it hit me over the ****ing face like a baseball bat literally a few days ago. That's part of what inspired this thread.

Responses have been very thoughtful, thank you for that. It's good to hear from so many folks.

I think I do good for selfish reasons now, because like Sinko I lost interest in the pursuit of constant highs in favor of investing in my future self out of necessity. The people who never wake up end up in a persistent sort of unhappy daze, or worse.

It has come to my attention tonight, however, that this thread title may be misleading. The title is misleading because I'd love to hear from the admittedly villainous or self-proclaimed evil people as well. Just don't incriminate yourself.

 

[Stylo]

I'm just over it. I already had my fun. I've already done most of the drugs I wanted to experiment with, and then a few more that I never even imagined myself doing.

Meh, I've never gotten that. Never done any of those "recreational drugs"and never wanted to. Always seemed like a pointless waste of time / money / health to me. Even when I was a teenager, never thought people who did them were cool / rebellious. Not that I've always been a God-like Saint or anything. Just my feelings on that point in particular, I suppose.

 

[sinkoman]

Meh, I've never gotten that. Never done any of those "recreational drugs"and never wanted to. Always seemed like a pointless waste of time / money / health to me. Even when I was a teenager, never thought people who did them were cool / rebellious. Not that I've always been a God-like Saint or anything. Just my feelings on that point in particular, I suppose.

Totally agree (well, maybe not on the "pointless waste of time" bit). Looking back on that time, I think I can safely say that a lot of the drugs I did, I did purely because I thought it somehow fed this stupid "rebellious" self image I had of myself. That's not to say that was the case all of the time though: The weed and acid, and most of the other "hallucinogens", were done purely out of curiosity. But the coke, morphine, and over the counter stuff? Totally for all the wrong reasons.

 

[Bad^Hat]

I think I do good for selfish reasons now, because like Sinko I lost interest in the pursuit of constant highs in favor of investing in my future self out of necessity. The people who never wake up end up in a persistent sort of unhappy daze, or worse.

Yep. I'm just trying to shake myself out of that sort of daze after years of aimless bullshit. Not even thrill seeking but just living indulgently, selfishly, man childishly. It wasn't really a conscious lifestyle choice but it's still one that I want to correct because, as I've discovered, that shit has an expiry date, and you do not want to be around when it hits. The crushing lack of self-worth was enough to make me want to pack it in, but luckily my anxiety kicked me in the ass and forced me to make some crucial changes to the way I was living in order to avoid even more crushing panic attacks and all manner of lovely shit like that. Hooray for being a ****ing head case! Now I'm actually doing something that gives me a sense of direction and accomplishment, something I've been sorely lacking for far too long. It hasn't been easy to step back out of my shell and reintegrate and all that good stuff, but boy oh boy it's almost starting to feel like it's worth it.

Spontaneous guts spillage, woo.

 

[Eejit]

I try to treat others as I would like to be treated. The more people that act this way the better it will be for everyone. I don't bother game theorying this shit though, that would get confussing.

The title is misleading because I'd love to hear from the admittedly villainous or self-proclaimed evil people as well. Just don't incriminate yourself.

Waiting for Darkside post? Or Pi?

 

[Stylo]

Totally agree (well, maybe not on the "pointless waste of time" bit). Looking back on that time, I think I can safely say that a lot of the drugs I did, I did purely because I thought it somehow fed this stupid "rebellious" self image I had of myself. That's not to say that was the case all of the time though: The weed and acid, and most of the other "hallucinogens", were done purely out of curiosity. But the coke, morphine, and over the counter stuff? Totally for all the wrong reasons.

Yeah, I guess I have the added thing of knowing some people closely who have ended up totally f**king their lives up by doing harder and harder stuff and then getting hooked on nasty shit. The thought of someone's existence becoming purely living for their next fix is a freaking sad one.

 

[15357]

I try to treat others as I would like to be treated. The more people that act this way the better it will be for everyone. I don't bother game theorying this shit though, that would get confussing.

Yeah, this seems most sensible.

I do try and game theory this shit sometimes, but it never gets anywhere.

 

[Stylo]

As far as treating other people goes, it's all about respect for me. If you're shown respect, you return it without question. If you aren't then there's no obligation in my mind to show them the same.

I don't really tend to hate people though. I just don't care for those that hate me. Another thing I see as a waste, devoting emotion and thoughts to someone you dislike and stewing over it. You'll never please everyone and no matter how hard you try, someone will always just dislike you because of who you are.

 

[Acepilotf14]

Integrity last, self before service, mediocrity in all we do.

The Air Force Creed.

 

[Viperidae]

Waiting for Darkside post? Or Pi?

Mine.

Through misanthropy, banning, and death, we're culling the human race and its culture. Fight mediocrity with evil. Your children will thank us.

 

[Shift]

Ommmm someone said God. And there is no good and bad, only pitless indifference haha.

Beliefs aside, we do good because we have an obligation to do good, its just part of our nature, part of the concept of morality, good and bad. Society champions the good, the bad are punished so obviously most of us are going to drift towards the good in a nutshell. The concept of morality philosophically speaking is complicated and broad.

 

[Stylo]

Ommmm

Childhood Mode: ON

 

[KiplingsCat]

Although I'm not at all religious, most of my views on treatment of others are based on the bible. "Do unto others" has been mentioned already. I'm also mindful of other pieces of biblical advise such as "judge not let ye be judged", and "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"...lots of people are pricks to other people simply because they have chosen to judge them in a certain way. You can think whatever you want about someone of course, but that shouldn't interfere or influence your dealings with them.

Another one I think is useful, but harder to follow, is the whole "turn the other cheek" thing. I could have avoided many unpleasant situations in the past if I'd just been more willing to let things go.

One philosophy I do have however, that some people don't agree with (cough cough my mother ahem cough cough), is that in order to be as helpful and useful and kind to others as I can, I need to attend to my own needs first. It's like in airplanes when they tell you to put on your own oxygen mask before seeing to your kid's one. If I'm not in at least a moderate state of happiness, I'm of no use much to anybody.

 

[Dog--]

Look at a colony of apes. They don't even know what god is and they obey the "laws" of their society. You don't steal from people or kill others because it's just not a good thing to do. You don't need god to tell you killing someone isn't a good thing to do.

Maybe you consider adultery appalling and. Perhaps you have opinions that you believe put you on a higher moral ground than a large proportion of the society you know.

This is a very awkwardly placed period, as well.

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

Look at a colony of apes. They don't even know what god is and they obey the "laws" of their society. You don't steal from people or kill others because it's just not a good thing to do. You don't need god to tell you killing someone isn't a good thing to do.

How very presumptuous of you. Might I also note, we are hardly apes anymore--they aren't about to invent thermonuclear weaponry or write in iambic pentameter, do calculus, etc. On the surface level, their behavior is less advanced than our earliest BC recorded history, no matter how close a 'relative' any species of ape may be.

...I have this feeling they're faking it all and planning something though. Dolphins and apes are very suspicious.

This is a very awkwardly placed period, as well.

Oops. It is indeed! Thanks for pointing that out. This was the result of my infamous over-editing. Fixed it up.

 

[Dog--]

How very presumptuous of you. Might I also note, we are hardly apes anymore--they aren't about to invent thermonuclear weaponry or write in iambic pentameter, do calculus, etc. On the surface level, their behavior is less advanced than our earliest BC recorded history, no matter how close a 'relative' any species of ape may be.

...I have this feeling they're faking it all and planning something though. Dolphins and apes are very suspicious.

I was just making a point saying you don't need religion to be a good person. Even godless apes have moral compasses that (most of the time) point them to behave in their societies. If we truly are more evolved than them, we don't need god to behave either.

That's not to say I'm bashing religion. If religion is what you need to do good, then by all means your beliefs are fine by me.

 

[Krynn72]

Stop comparing humans to apes guys. We're nothing alike.

Spoiler

 

[Sheepo]

I think it's really interesting to note how this thread about morality, which is generally seen as concerning our interactions with other people or things, or actions that directly impact other people or things, has turned somewhat inward and become self-centered in its reflections and pondering. That sounds critical, but it's not. It kinda reinforces what I've always thought and what several others have said or implied in this thread: If you're not well, you won't act or treat others well, be the change you want to see in the world, etc. There are certainly exceptions, but well balanced, happy, productive, healthy people are far less likely to steal, kill, and rape their way through life. And the more people there are doing those things the more people they affect who become unbalanced, unhappy, and unhealthy. Stable people beget more stable people and more morality and the same goes for the unstable and immorality. Straightening my life out is the most fundamental and best thing I can do for the world, everything else is secondary.

 

[Krynn72]

The only interesting thing about it is how people in this thread even have to ponder such a obvious fact. If you're pissed off or stressed out all the time then no shit you're going to tend to be more immoral in the way you act. That kind of thing happens every day. When you literally can't give another ****, then you stop caring about other people's problems and do whatever the hell you need to do without regard to others. Is that really such a shocking notion to people here... and/or Kiplings Mom?

 

[Sheepo]

I'd say it's just an interesting observation giving the generally social nature of morality, plus I think it's just taken for granted in just how large in impact (I think) it has. And yeah, I guess since I don't count the time in dog years I'm just not nearly as wise as you are yet.

 

[Shift]

I was just making a point saying you don't need religion to be a good person.

If anything, religion with all its dogma is more likely to make you into a bad person. Also interestingly enough, Christians, who are clearly obliged to follow a certain set of moral values, are actually taught that they are fundamentally bad people or sinners, and there isn't anything they can do about it, its just within the nature of humanity. They are also taught that there is nothing they can do personally to fix that problem, that it must come from a higher power. Makes you wonder how Christians (though obviously not all) live with a high morality when they are essentially being taught that they are incapable of doing so.

 

[Eejit]

Weren't you religious a while ago Shift? Or am I confusing you with someone else?

*grumbles about avatar changes*

 

[KiplingsCat]

Is that really such a shocking notion to people here... and/or Kiplings Mom?

I think there's this conception out there that in order to be a good person, you must always, invariably, put the needs of others before your own, and that if you do put your needs before those of other people's, for whatever reason, you're a bad, selfish person. I think it's pretty shortsighted to blindly serve others before yourself in every situation, because if you carry on like that, eventually you're going to end up being useless/dead. And then what good are you?