Game of Thrones thread with lots of books spoilers inside spoiler tags

[Sheepo]

Really it only comes down to one or two episodes I think, but in the book

Spoiler

they capture Ygritte because Jon Snow's surprised she's a woman, as the show portrayed, but when he's left to kill her he deliberately lets her go instead. Though Jon never directly says it (or he may, I don't remember exactly) Half-Hand says something that heavily implies he expected Jon to do that and, I atleast thought, he gives the impression that they expected the Free Folk would hunt and capture them eventually anyway. After that there's much and more wandering through the mountains, showing off what badasses the Watch has, and eventually getting caught up in some mountain pass where Half-Hand has instructed Jon explicitly that he must fight him in order to win the Free Folk's trust.

It's not too different honestly. I just think in the show version it really gives the impression that the Free Folk are pretty much super locked on and that the Watch are all kind of bumbling buffoons, Jon especially.

 

[ríomhaire]

Sam be ****ed.

 

[MJ12]

So, I haven't seen all the episodes; does Tyrion make that hilarious, albeit horrible joke about Tommen to Cersie that he does in the book?

 

[Krynn72]

Nope

 

[15357]

Speaking of prophesies: You gonna betray everyone everyday everywhere Stannis Baratheon. BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT WILL TAKE. Um, nah, that doesn't make much sense actually.

I think the House of Undying scene was pretty solid, although I didn't enjoy the outright antagonism of everybody in Qarth. And in a sense, Dany pretty much killed the entire structure and government of Qarth, which would be a pretty big ****ing deal and would probably haunt her for ages in the books, but they're probably just gonna be like, welp, whatevs, what's Qarth anyway? This is season 3. I honestly just wish they'd left the Dany bits boring and thus allow more time to hit the stuff they missed.

Winterfell sucked. It's confusing in the book, but what? We have no idea who's outside Winterfell. The Stark garrison, the Boltons. Who sacks it? Where does everyone go? Literally not the slightest idea of what may have happened, let alone what actually happened. Non readers are probably pissed as shit about that. I would be.

North of the Wall was nice. Jon's story ended pretty well despite him spending the entire season just being crazy incompetent and dopey. Others look great. But uh, how's Sam gonna get back on the fist? He's behind the enemy line. And fat.

Edit: Oh, and was anyone else bothered by the fact that the red comet was in the first episode, and then never seen or spoken of again?

Agreed with every point.

And I'd even forgotten that the red comet even existed. :O

 

[JUL3]

Spoiler

So who is the White Walker on the horse?

 

[ríomhaire]

Spoiler

What do you mean who? The white walkers aren't undead, only the wights. The white walkers/others are a living race.

 

[MJ12]

Spoiler

So who is the White Walker on the horse?

Spoiler

Ned Stark

Spoiler

Jk, gotcha, fooled ya'

 

[Sheepo]

I know this is nit-picky, but one of the most jarring (in a bad way) additions to the season is Jaime killing his cousin. Jaime is a piece of shite for sure, (and he doesn't like his cousin) but the fact that they had the two bond with each other on an almost Uncle to Nephew type level, only for Jaime to brutally beat his face in the next minute made Jaime seem over the top evil.

I can see your point, however that was one of the few examples of obvious changes in the show that I actually liked. Generally when I whine about the show people will tell me to not get so caught up in having a exact translation from the book and accept that the show should have its own style and flavor to really grow. Generally I ignore them, because the changes I complain of are generally absolutely unnecessary and are flat out dumb and counterproductive to good entertainment, but in this case I thought it was a very compelling change. In the books everyone either loathes, has contempt for, or admires the wit/cunning/charisma of Jaime to an absurd degree but it never seemed all that justified based on what we saw of him. Once you get his POV in SOS he's probably also one of the most sympathetic characters and has pretty much nothing going to make him the least bit hateable. That scene shows him to be incredibly ruthless and violent, charming and compelling, and gives a really interesting bit of his background.

 

[JUL3]

So what's the difference between a Wight and a White Walker?

 

[ríomhaire]

Spoiler

So what's the difference between a Wight and a White Walker? I've never even heard the term 'Wight', is it used in the show? Or is it a thing that only people who have read the books understand?

And so is the bloke on the horse a Wight, or a White Walker?

I've been hearing speculation that it is Khal Drogo - predicated mainly on the fact that his horse got cut, and the dead horse got cut.

Spoiler

I'm not really sure if they ever went over the difference in the show. In the books the White Walkers are usually called the Others (which they probably dropped due to being too like Lost). They're some sort of magical (and definitely intelligent) race who live in the far north and seem to hate mankind. Martin has explicitly stated that the Others are not dead but there's really not much detail about them to go on other than they almost wiped out Westeros during "The Long Night." They have a description in the books very different to how they look in the TV show; they have perfect smooth white skin.

There is also a story about a Lord Commander of the Night's Watch who was bewitched by and married a female Other and declared himself the Night's King. He attempted to rule the lands around the Wall until his brother the King in the North and the King Beyond the Wall teamed up to defeat him.

Wights are the Others' personal zombie army. If you're killed by an Other or a wight you get back up as wight. At the end of the series there you saw an army of wights being commanded by a few Others on horseback.

 

[knut]

Spoiler

I've been hearing speculation that it is Khal Drogo - predicated mainly on the fact that his horse got cut, and the dead horse got cut.

Spoiler

except for that drogo and his horse were thousand of leagues away from anywhere near the wall, on another continent, even. it's not drogo, it's just an other.

 

[JUL3]

Spoiler

except for that drogo and his horse were thousand of leagues away from anywhere near the wall, on another continent, even. it's not drogo, it's just an other.

Spoiler

Ohh okay, thanks for clearing that up Riom.

So it's an Other from another mother.
Another thing was that Khaleesi met Drogo in that tent in the snow, and he said something like "I don't know where I am" - is there no way that might be significant?

 

[morgs]

Spoiler

That was the warlock guy making an illusion, I'm pretty sure.

 

[knut]

believe me, it's not drogo. i say that as someone who has read the books, too.

 

[Sheepo]

Spoiler

I've been hearing speculation that it is Khal Drogo.

I've never heard anything so ludicrous ever. Are non-readers really that bewildered/uncertain about the show?

 

[Krynn72]

Its Ned. The other Other is Syrio. It all makes sense trust me.

 

[JUL3]

Apparently so. Maybe it's hard to imagine what watching this show is like without having read the books - it seems to me rather like watching Harry Potter without having read the books. Everything is mysterious, and we clutch at straws to have it make sense.

I don't think it's too far-fetched to think that it's Drogo - consider it from our perspective. Given what we've been given from the show, it has something to it: Drogo's horse; the Wight's horse, Drogo in the snow; Wight in the snow, etc. *Be clear that I'm not arguing it is Drogo, I'm sure it isn't based on what all of you are telling me. But it's not so ludicrous from our perspective.

Anyway, A Song of Ice and Fire is right up the top of my bucket list for after this year. Out of curiosity, how does this series compare, as literature, to say Lord of the Rings? Or something more modern, like The Inheritance Cycle?

 

[Sheepo]

I don't think it's too far-fetched to think that it's Drogo - consider it from our perspective. Given what we've been given from the show, it has something to it: Drogo's horse; the Wight's horse, Drogo in the snow; Wight in the snow, etc. *Be clear that I'm not arguing it is Drogo, I'm sure it isn't based on what all of you are telling me. But it's not so ludicrous from our perspective.

Well, just to be definitive in explanation, why it definitely can't be Drogo: White Walkers aren't dead reanimated like wights, so Drogo would have to have always been a white walker to be one. Drogo's never been in Westeros. Perhaps I'm forgetting exactly how the show played this out, but I don't recall him being depicted in the snow. And as Morgs says, that Drogo is an entirely an illusion created by the warlocks for their own purposes. Did we even see what Drogo's horse looked like after the magi messed with it in the show? Because I've always had the impression she pretty much ripped that thing all up. Anyway, in the book there's no special zoom in on any particular White Walker that could cause the reader to be like, "Oooh, he's special, what's his story?" In the show they show one White Walker at the very end, so I guess people are getting the impression he's all special and significant, when really he's just this one white, menacing, mystical dude of many. Maybe he will be special in the way that one Orc that seems to be important keeps reoccurring in the LOTR movies, but he's really not spectacularly signigicant or anything.

 

[Viperidae]

Out of curiosity, how does this series compare, as literature, to say Lord of the Rings? Or something more modern, like The Inheritance Cycle?

Pretty light on themes and ideas (or at the least, he sticks to a couple and doesn't waver). Pretty much pulp character novels. Events/shocker moments can get pretty cliche. The series is getting more and more dialogue heavy, almost like a play. It's almost the opposite of Tolkien in that he's somewhat lazy with creating/immersing you in the world proper and spends most of his efforts on the characters. Can get very indoors-soap opera.

 

[Eejit]

Haha.

Anyway, A Song of Ice and Fire is right up the top of my bucket list for after this year. Out of curiosity, how does this series compare, as literature, to say Lord of the Rings? Or something more modern, like The Inheritance Cycle?

The Inheritance Cycle? Jesus, that's about the worst shit out there besides Goodkind's series.

A Song of Ice and Fire is a great read but in a literary sense it doesn't compare to Lord of the Rings. Tolkien knew language better than any other fantasy author, even the odd-seeming choices in places are entirely deliberate.
However the plot, intrigue and characters are among the best in the genre, and few use better prose. Much of the other much lauded modern fantasy is stupidly grimdark (e.g. Joe Abercrombie) whereas I think GRRM strikes a good balance.

 

[JUL3]

Haha.



The Inheritance Cycle? Jesus, that's about the worst shit out there besides Goodkind's series.

A Song of Ice and Fire is a great read but in a literary sense it doesn't compare to Lord of the Rings. Tolkien knew language better than any other fantasy author, even the odd-seeming choices in places are entirely deliberate.
However the plot, intrigue and characters are among the best in the genre, and few use better prose. Much of the other much lauded modern fantasy is stupidly grimdark (e.g. Joe Abercrombie) whereas I think GRRM strikes a good balance.

I liked Inheritance. Maybe it's only good for teens or something though.

Excellent, I'm looking forward to reading it.

 

[Eejit]

I liked Inheritance. Maybe it's only good for teens or something though.

Inheritance had some fairly dire prose iirc, but mainly it's FULL of cheap clichés and is hugely derivative. I understand that's maybe not apparent to those without much prior reading in the genre however.

Oh and White Walker Drogo is silly, whoever came up with it is a silly-head.

 

[The Monkey]

New cast of season 3:

More confirmed cast not included in the video:
http://www.westeros.org/GoT/News/Entry/Massive_Comic-Con_Casting_Reveals/

 

[Rorschach120]

I know this is nit-picky, but one of the most jarring (in a bad way) additions to the season is Jaime killing his cousin. Jaime is a piece of shite for sure, (and he doesn't like his cousin) but the fact that they had the two bond with each other on an almost Uncle to Nephew type level, only for Jaime to brutally beat his face in the next minute made Jaime seem over the top evil.

Don't read if you haven't read Storm of Swords

Spoiler

I think they want to prepare the viewers to think that Jaime deserves to get his hand chopped off. In the book he gets it chopped off and then begins to warm up to Brienne and saves her. Typical TV character transition.

 

[Krynn72]

This starts up again on the 31st of this month.

 

[morgs]

Man, it's been so long since season 2. Hearing the opening music brings it all back though. The feeling you get when you watch it.

 

[Sheepo]

I much prefer hearing the same people yammer about Game of Thrones every single week than I do hearing them yammer about Walking Dead, so I welcome this. Also, after not thinking about this show for months I am capable of incautious optimism.

 

[ríomhaire]

Doctor Who and Game of Thrones start up again on the same weekend

 

[bobtheskull]

Doctor Who and Game of Thrones start up again on the same weekend

Yep... soooo can't wait! Specially Game of Thrones. I'm just hoping Doctor Who doesn't go down the road I'm expecting it to.

 

[Lobster]

 

[JUL3]

So what's the difference between a Wight and a White Walker?

Now I know. Started reading the series a couple of months back, halfway through A Dance with Dragons now. Super psyched for the new season to start. Already anticipating an epic season finale:

Spoiler

A red wedding maybe? Or Joffrey's demise? It's meant to be the first half of Storm of Swords, but Steel and Snow barely ended on anything TV worthy. I'm guessing it'll be the Red Wedding.

 

[Krynn72]

I think this will probably be one of, if not the best season in the show. Everything is established now and its all going to be thrown into high gear from here on out. The stakes were high and consequences harsh so far, but god damn, its only getting started. The nearer we get to the premier the more antsy I get. Can't wait for this.

 

[ríomhaire]

Now I know. Started reading the series a couple of months back, halfway through A Dance with Dragons now. Super psyched for the new season to start. Already anticipating an epic season finale:

Spoiler

A red wedding maybe? Or Joffrey's demise? It's meant to be the first half of Storm of Swords, but Steel and Snow barely ended on anything TV worthy. I'm guessing it'll be the Red Wedding.

I thinl the penultimate episode is called

Spoiler

the Rains of Castamere so probably the Red Wedding.

 

[The Monkey]

Another trailer:

A two minute one is due tomorrow.

 

[JUL3]

Plenty of new footage.

Riom;

Spoiler

I fear I'm missing something, what significance is The Rains of Castamere?
Penultimate ending would be how they do it, now that I think on it, episode 9 has been the climax of the past two seasons: Eddard's beheading and the Battle of Blackwater.

 

[ríomhaire]

BOOK/FUTURE SHOW SPOILERS

Riom;

Spoiler

I fear I'm missing something, what significance is The Rains of Castamere?
Penultimate ending would be how they do it, now that I think on it, episode 9 has been the climax of the past two seasons: Eddard's beheading and the Battle of Blackwater.

Spoiler

Rains of Castamere is a song about how Tywin Lannister wiped out every member of house Reyne and it was used as a signal in the Red Wedding for when to begin the slaughter so it's the song Robb and Cat died to.

 

[Wanted Bob]

Pretty excited for this. Caught up on seasons 1 and 2 over the summer, so I've been anticipating this for a while now

 

[JUL3]

Spoiler

Rains of Castamere is a song about how Tywin Lannister wiped out every member of house Reyne and it was used as a signal in the Red Wedding for when to begin the slaughter so it's the song Robb and Cat died to.

Spoiler

Ahh, interesting. Thanks man.

 

[Krynn72]

Spoiler

Rains of Castamere is a song about how Tywin Lannister wiped out every member of house Reyne and it was used as a signal in the Red Wedding for when to begin the slaughter so it's the song Robb and Cat died to.

This is a book spoiler, something the show hasn't come to yet. As some people here are watching the show as their first experience, and this thread is about the show, they may open your spoiler thinking its about something that happened in the show already. You may ruin somebody's day if you don't edit the post or make it very clear your spoiler is a book spoiler, not a show spoiler.