Mass Effect 3

I actually loved mass effect 3's ending. I can understand why fans of the series were left feeling cheated because their choices through out the series resulted to nothing, but I actually like it turned out that way you're choice resulted in that because it reinforced the way the reapers have had controlled organice life. In the end shepard is absolutely doomed no matter what choices you've made or you're ****ing military strength. At the end of the day it reinforces the idea that no matter what choice you choose artificial intelligence is going to happen and the cycle of the reapers is just going to happen again in the mass effect universe
 
Then you missed the point of the entire Mass Effect series, which is that life has a choice. ME wasn't about a pretentious AI from the Citadel controlling the Reapers to supposedly save organic life, it was about making a difference in the galaxy, about choosing your own fate, rather have it determined by ancient war machines. We spend the entire game building up the largest military force the galaxy has ever seen, uniting the species for the first time.

But the ending pretty much ignores that, ignores everything and presents three arbitrary choices that are completely disconnected from the rest of the game, both plotwise and thematically. You make several hard choices and expect to see them come back. But no, the author seemingly thought that trying to pull off a 2001 was more interesting.

You know what would be more interesting? EMS directly determining the success at Earth. The Crucible playing an actual strategic role. The Illusive Man representing a Renegade choice, not a Reaper puppet that studied how to make Reapers his puppets (uh, yeah, think about the logic here). Finally, the game giving the player feedback on the choices they made. Did Krogan Rebellions happen again, as Salarians feared? How did the Asari react to losing their homeworld and what was the impact? Long term Quarian/Geth development?

That'd make the Stargazer bit meaningful, shown that Shepard really did have an impact on the galaxy. But as it stands, Aldrin's effort is completely wasted.
 
Rumors of an ending-themed DLC flitting about the net. Also, Bioware stated that because this game was obviously to be the last of the trilogy that "wildly divergent" endings were to be a given. Different color effects don't pass that test. While I wasn't too pleased with the endings to begin with, I've become more disenchanted with them after having that notion stew a bit. It was not just that the endings were depressing, but that they were decidedly vague. Where Bioware surely goes from here, will be an intersting thing to see, if nothing else but for observation of fan reaction.
 
The ending choices sucked but I wouldn't have minded them if they at least put in a true paragon ending. I don't care how lame it sounds, I wanted to be the ultimate hero, which was to unite the galaxy, have them live in peace or at least for a while, defeat the reapers, and have Shepard live on. They could have kept the other retarded endings and just added this one. And I hate how some people are saying life doesn't always have happy endings. Really? Some people live crappy lives everyday and play video games to get lost in that world, where they can be the ultimate hero. After all, it is called a "Role Playing" game for a reason.
 
Tagaziel said:
Then you missed the point of the entire Mass Effect series, which is that life has a choice. ME wasn't about a pretentious AI from the Citadel controlling the Reapers to supposedly save organic life, it was about making a difference in the galaxy, about choosing your own fate, rather have it determined by ancient war machines. We spend the entire game building up the largest military force the galaxy has ever seen, uniting the species for the first time.

But the ending pretty much ignores that, ignores everything and presents three arbitrary choices that are completely disconnected from the rest of the game, both plotwise and thematically. You make several hard choices and expect to see them come back. But no, the author seemingly thought that trying to pull off a 2001 was more interesting.

You know what would be more interesting? EMS directly determining the success at Earth. The Crucible playing an actual strategic role. The Illusive Man representing a Renegade choice, not a Reaper puppet that studied how to make Reapers his puppets (uh, yeah, think about the logic here). Finally, the game giving the player feedback on the choices they made. Did Krogan Rebellions happen again, as Salarians feared? How did the Asari react to losing their homeworld and what was the impact? Long term Quarian/Geth development?

That'd make the Stargazer bit meaningful, shown that Shepard really did have an impact on the galaxy. But as it stands, Aldrin's effort is completely wasted.
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I don't think I have missed the point, the main thing that captivated me about mass effect was the choices and they did have a knock on event during the course of the games. I also have an affinity for stories that are on a epic scale. I do agree with you on having a bit more exposure to what happened after the end of the game.
 
Just noticed the credits song was a song from Faunts' most recent album. Too bad it did not fit at all like M4 Part II did for ME1 the first time around. Good song though. The rest of the album is...eh.
 
As sympathetic as I am for people who are so let down by something, I can't help but think this could set a bad precedent for the future. With customers forming angry mobs every time they disagree with a developers decision, citing BioWare as an example of when it worked.

I can't really comment on the ME3 ending, as I have yet to pickup the game. But from what people have been saying, the hate is probably justified in this case. But what if the situation were different? What if a group of people were calling for a developer to change something you LIKED about a game? Bowing to pressure from your loudest critics, can lead to other problems, regardless of how right they may be.

I would hope that whatever they plan to change, simply adds choice and expansion to the ending, rather than a complete retcon. Sometimes you have to accept your failures and move on, rather than forever seeking approval from the masses. Then again this is EA/BioWare, the people who once got away with a Facebook vote that essentially asked "Which ethnicity is best?".
 
They should apologize and stop selling Dragon Age 2 and remake it as a decent game, if they're going to submit to nerd rage.
 
Still not convinced that these changes are in direct response to the outrage - they already planned post-ending dlc (which really does suggest that there was something amiss about the ending as continuing the story might be somewhat... problematic with the state it left the galaxy in.

There certainly may be tweaks to the dlc but I'm not convinced that something along the lines of what the community has demanded was not already on the cards.
 
I think that's actually even worse. A complete and total cop out and just points to milking fans. Ugh, I just want this shit to stop being spammed all over gaming news sites. Tired of the Bioware drama. At this rate I hope they just stop. Bioware and their remaining fans.
 
I don't understand how they managed to screw up the ending so damn badly.

The game as a whole was, I thought, stunningly well written. In fact, if we ignore the small things like the stupid side quests and having such an abundance of credits that you can basically buy everything, I thought the game was damn near perfect. There's only a handful of games which have ever captivated me in such a way from start to finish (the original Mass Effect amongst them - but I could never bring myself to feel bothered to replay it, whilst I'm happily doing that with ME3 already - that's one of those games where you really notice the flaws after you come away from it). And I've never played anything, ever, which has anything like the emotional impact Mass Effect 3 regularly manages. It's also filled with epic and memorable "moments", something Human Revolution was curiously lacking in...

And I can't stand Mass Effect 2. Actually playing this game highlights my disappointment in how they could have done a much better job of making a great trilogy all round. I wasn't expecting much from it but I was definitely proven wrong.

So...what the hell were they thinking with the ending? Even the final mission was brilliant...right up until that last 10 minutes or so. It's not that it's bleak - a bleak ending is certainly in keeping with the theme of the game and to be expected. It's that it makes no damn sense on any level. Bizarre.
 
One of the issues I had with the ending mission is how much its built up that your old mates are getting geared up for the fight (the thing that sticks with me is the shadow broker message about Zaeed's recent aquisitions including the parts to repair "jessie") but then all we're treated to is a brief goodbye message over the comm. I was really hoping to be fighting alongside my old crew, even if briefly - seeing Zaeed's old rifle back in action, Grunt leading his commando team, etc, etc.

Not that the final mission was bad, it just wasn't quite as good as I'd expected it to be.
 
Now that's uncalled for. So fans calling out Bioware on their lack of creative consistency in their own title and non-existent creative control when it comes to the last 5-10 minutes of the game are somehow the villains here?

Talk about being a jackass with a comic strip.
 
It doesn't matter how crap the ending is, even if its the most awful thing they have ever made. The moment you start changing things to please your fans, you are no longer writing from any kind of vision at all, it just becomes fan-service. Everything you do from that moment onwards, will be based entirely on how many Likes you get on Facebook.

Bad endings happen all the time in fiction, but most writers don't get to have do-overs just because it will be more popular. If Mass Effect had a shitty ending, then it should be remembered as such forever.
 
So, all that rage because fans don't like the ending of a story? Wow, we should wipe out half of the books and movies out there. Much ado about nothing.
 
Bloody hell you guys talking about? ME was made with responses from the fans in the first place. If fans didn't have favorite characters, lines, and some level of expectation, Bio wouldn't get feedback of this magnitude in the first place.
 
Lobster said:
It doesn't matter how crap the ending is, even if its the most awful thing they have ever made. The moment you start changing things to please your fans, you are no longer writing from any kind of vision at all, it just becomes fan-service. Everything you do from that moment onwards, will be based entirely on how many Likes you get on Facebook.

Bad endings happen all the time in fiction, but most writers don't get to have do-overs just because it will be more popular. If Mass Effect had a shitty ending, then it should be remembered as such forever.
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It's not a case of it simply being a "bad ending", it literally makes no sense at all, within the context of the story itself. It's absolutely something that can and should be fixed. It's by no means unprecedented anyway, Blade Runner and the Director's Cut of the same have wildly different endings.

Similarly, I doubt you'd find anyone complaining if Eidos Montreal went back and finished DX:HR by adding in the significant amount of cut content from the latter half of the game, which would also have the effect of significantly altering the storyline.
 
Here's some well detailed evidence of the indoctrination theory. It's a nice 20 minute vid, I recommend watching the whole thing. Also, here's an article also worth a read: http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertc...mass-effect-3-ending-go-over-everyones-heads/

The part that's been quite prevalent to me about this whole situation for a while is also there:

If $15 ending DLC hits shelves in a month or two that reveals this theory as correct, it will be one of the lowest points in video game history. Had a complete ending been fashioned alongside this plot twist, Mass Effect could have been the greatest story ever told through the medium and fans would have bowed at Bioware’s feet, praising them for the best finale they’ve ever seen. But instead, if the “true” ending really was cut to be sold later as DLC, it’s proof that maybe video games aren’t art after all. They’re just a product to be bought and sold in pieces regardless of the effect such decisions may have on the experience or the story. And if said DLC is free, the way I've previously suggested it should be as an apology to fans? Then it really just should have been in the game in the first place.
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Vid:

 
So, let me get one thing straight:

If the end all becomes a hallucination prior to or instantly as Shepard reaches the beam, that means: that the reapers are still on and around Earth, the crucible hasn't linked with The Citadel, and Shepard is just laying in a rubble heap in London alive and dreaming, yet has ultimately defeated indoctrination? That sound right?
 
repiV said:
It's by no means unprecedented anyway, Blade Runner and the Director's Cut of the same have wildly different endings.
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This is true, but director's cuts are usually made because the director himself is unhappy with the original version. I personally think there is a difference between changing your writing because YOU are unhappy with it, and changing it because a bunch of other people told you THEY were unhappy with it.

Maybe I am alone in that, but I feel this way regardless of how personally invested I am in the story. I think the Star Wars prequels were bloody awful, and wish they could be burned and forgotten, but I don't feel I have the right (as a fan) to demand that.

I heard that Childs-Play had to block all donations from the petition, because people started asking for their donations back. I am not saying this is representative of everyone who signed the petition, far from it. I am certain the vast majority of people involved are well meaning and intelligent people. I just don't want to see the 'Charity Petition' become the magic-bullet for fan demands.

Back on topic though, didn't an ending to ME3 get leaked in a beta last year? Did they change anything as a result of that leak?
 
Lobster said:
It doesn't matter how crap the ending is, even if its the most awful thing they have ever made. The moment you start changing things to please your fans, you are no longer writing from any kind of vision at all, it just becomes fan-service. Everything you do from that moment onwards, will be based entirely on how many Likes you get on Facebook.

Bad endings happen all the time in fiction, but most writers don't get to have do-overs just because it will be more popular. If Mass Effect had a shitty ending, then it should be remembered as such forever.
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Seriously? That's your argument? Stuff gets changed all the time, often as a result of audience input. You somehow failed to understand that Bioware is going to change the ending because of fan input, not according to player input. The same way the person who authored that moronic comic strip above did.

Furthermore, what is fan service? George Martin includes kudos to one of his closest friends (wife? sister?) for convincing him to bring back dragons. Does that make A Song of Ice and Fire divorced from his vision and pure fanservice?

Please stop employing a asinum arguments.
 
Tagaziel said:
Furthermore, what is fan service? George Martin includes kudos to one of his closest friends (wife? sister?) for convincing him to bring back dragons. Does that make A Song of Ice and Fire divorced from his vision and pure fanservice?
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I just think its different when its a change made to something that has already been released. Obviously BioWare's games are almost entirely built on fan pandering. EDI wouldn't have had a body in ME3 if it wasn't for all the slash art for instance.

But if 'A Song of Ice and Fire' had been released without any dragons, and people said "You know what that story needed? More dragons!" wouldn't it be weird for him to re release the book like that? and what would happen if people had even more problems with the second version, where does it end?

I have moaned and whined enough in this thread though! I hope I didn't cause any offence before, it was not my intention.
 
Question to general series fans: Does the first game have DLC? How much does it cost? Call all versions get the DLC or would I have to buy from certain online distributors for it?
 
ríomhaire said:
Question to general series fans: Does the first game have DLC? How much does it cost? Call all versions get the DLC or would I have to buy from certain online distributors for it?
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There are two pieces of DLC for Mass Effect 1. Bring Down The Sky and Pinnacle Station.

The last time I tried to get BDTS the page it was on hadn't been updated with the rest of EA's big site upgrade a year or two ago. So the link was broken. The DLC was free to anyone with an original copy of the game, there was a CD Key entry page that unlocked it for you, not sure if that is still working though.

http://masseffect.bioware.com/me1/galacticcodex/bringdownthesky_pc.html

As for Pinnacle Station, you used to be able to purchase it directly from their site, but the site upgrade broke that aswell. It is however available on Origin.

http://store.origin.com/store/eaemea/en_GB/DisplayProductDetailsPage/productID.152041300
 
Ok so if I was getting it I'd want to get the full game I'd need to register it on Origin, eh? After a quick google it seems to say that you can't register Mass Effect CD keys from Steam with Origin. Does anyone know if retail copies can be?
 
Lobster said:
I just think its different when its a change made to something that has already been released. Obviously BioWare's games are almost entirely built on fan pandering. EDI wouldn't have had a body in ME3 if it wasn't for all the slash art for instance.
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It isn't different. It's all a response to feedback. BioWare simply didn't have anyone brave enough to tell the director "No. That's ****ing stupid. We can't release the game like that", so the duty fell to the players.

But if 'A Song of Ice and Fire' had been released without any dragons, and people said "You know what that story needed? More dragons!" wouldn't it be weird for him to re release the book like that? and what would happen if people had even more problems with the second version, where does it end?
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Actually, a better analogy would be him changing the next part to include dragons. Which he did in response to feedback from those close to him.
 
I just finished the game and in my opinion this is the best game in the series. However I agree with the raging fans the ending sucked ass! The way I see it the entire point of playing an RPG is choice. There should've been a multitude of possible endings ranging from total doom and gloom to "everyone lives happily ever after". If I wanted an ending shoved down my throat by a game story writer I would play a linear FPS.
 
Just ended the game as well, loved every moment of the game till the very end. I'm actually a little puzzled as to what happened in the end. I honestly don't know what to feel just yet, I'm still reading about other people's experiences, some people got completely different scenes from what I got to see. It just left me asking for more answers, basically what happened to life afterwards. Guess we'll see what the next DLC brings us.
 
There are 3 or 4 endings, I'm not sure. Bottom line is the differences are very small and in all of them these things happen:
-the mass relay system is destroyed
-Shep dies
-All the fleets that helped with the war are stranded in the Sol system. With Earth in ruins, resources depleted, and no food, they will all starve to death.
-The Normandy and it's crew manages to escape only to be strande on a random planet in the middle of nowhere.
 
Remus said:
-the mass relay system is destroyed
-Shep dies
-All the fleets that helped with the war are stranded in the Sol system. With Earth in ruins, resources depleted, and no food, they will all starve to death.
-The Normandy and it's crew manages to escape only to be strande on a random planet in the middle of nowhere.
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Or, apparently, it's all in Shepard's head.
 
sixteenth said:
Or, apparently, it's all in Shepard's head.
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imager.php
 
Well I guess that implies that, with Origin, you don't actually own the game.
 
sixteenth said:
Well I guess that implies that, with Origin, you don't actually own the game.
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Which you generally don't. EA owns the game; you merely receive a non-exclusive, transferrable licence to use their programming. A lease, if you wish.
 
That goes for basically all digital distro to different degrees really, I'm just astonished at how far certain big name devs are taking it. It's like they don't even give a shit about maintaining the illusion of ownership.
 
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